To think we consider ourselves, as a people, the most enlightened we have ever been, and we are still tripping over the subject of race speaks volumes - it is going to be a long time before race becomes a non-factor, as much as people try to claim things are equal across the board. In a perfect world where race is meaningless, you wouldn't have the following:

- Racial stereotypes: All hispanics are illegal immigrants who work in lawn care, all blacks disrespect their women, all asians are booksmart video gamers, white people are terrible at basketball, etc.

- Media bias in the news: Selective reporting/coverage goes both ways. While there's a prominance of "missing white girl" stories that people like to joke about, black on white violence is virtually invisible to the media (but not invisible to statistics - http://ourcivilisation.com/usa/racewar.htm ), such is the 'walking on eggshells' approach to crime reporting.

- Harmful media attention (other than news): Anyone who thinks BET is anything but a perpetuator of black stereotypes (materialistic, misogynistic, violent) needs to wake up.

- Affirmative action: Filling 'quotas' to promote 'diversity' is counter-productive. It promotes prejudice among those adversely affected who grow resentful of the beneficiaries of it. It is arguable that it represses the qualified in favor of the not-so-qualified.. all in the name of 'equality.'

Until people stop blaming others for their own problems and hold themselves to higher standards (triumph over the notions stereotypes perpetuate), nothing will ever change.

That was not my defense speech. I got angry. I messed up. I said I was sorry. I retired. Currently I am getting some spiritual healing. So can we please move on?

You're boring. Moar unreasonable debate please.

Much egg on your face for quoting me after I edited.

http://stevegilliard.blogspot.com/2006/09/...ure-racist.html

Here is a nice little place that breaks up the arguments one by one.

When I was in primary school (around 11 years old), some guy in the year below me (for a reason I can't remember) looked at me contemptuously and said "White person" under his breath (It was kind of funny, he was 2/3 of my size). I tolled my eyes and said "Yes, and you're a black person" back to him (I wasn't insulting him by that, I was pointing out the uselessness of what he'd said). He immediately went running to a teacher who was standing in the playground and told him that I was being a racist. The teacher asked me what happened, and I told him. He told us to wait where we were, and went of into the school building. A minute later, he came back out with a dictionary and gave it to the other guy, and told him to look up "Racism", and said I could go.

While I disagree with the way whoever wrote this expressed his views, The basic point about the silliness of people considering racism a one-way concept are correct. It's a pretty unfortunate state of affairs, but it's unlikely to change for a long time.

Exactly what I meant to highlight, Ytraelux. I wasn't trying to condone any sort of prejudice sentiments with my post. I just wanted to show how the race card is always being played in society. I would appreciate it if the people who have made comments about me being a klansmen would stop because I would never have any affiliation with that group of 's.

EDIT: Clearly I did not read the rest of the thread, where people already pointed out that it was not Michael Richards who said this.




I think it could be interpreted either way. I interpreted "you" as referring to all people who actually do those things - he never defined it to mean black people, italian people, or any other color of people. It was a general "you" that was not addressed to anyone specifically. I think that part of what he's talking about is that people have a tendency to play the racism card when it really isn't warranted at all. I am not racist - which, by definition, means I do not prefer blacks, whites, browns, reds, or anyone else to anyone else based on their color. By that same definition, I would say that most of the organizations and practices he mentioned are racist - BET is marketed specifically to "black" people, NAACP is created to further the interests of non-white people, Black History Month is a special month to focus on the history specifically of black people. He didn't even mention things like Affirmative Action, which I see as equally problematic.

I agree with whoever it was that said racism is still around today. I've heard a lot of it - but I also take sharp issue with people who try to combat racism with opposing racism. Either we are all the same, or we are not. You cannot accuse other people of being racist against you while joining groups which praise your race over others, no matter what color you are.

I think that's the idea of the point being made here (though, again, I am not sure it was Michael Richards who said it, these points have been covered by many people before). I agree with the ideas behind them - not that I think it is okay to have a NAAWP to further the interests of white people, but I think it is not okay to have an organization that supports any race over another.

Perhaps you should follow the link given in the one of the replies here to a page that dissects the claims of this e-mail.

I am unsure people understand what racism is. Forming an organization to assist members of a certain race is not racism. Celebrating the history of a minority race is not racism. Having a television network specifically targetted towards a specific race is not racism. Racism is as follows:

1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

None of the examples (besides the insults) in that e-mail qualify for racism. To be blunt, the reason that things exist for the benefit of particular minority races is because the majority race has so marginalized minority races in the United States for so long that such institutions were and remain to be necessary.

Racism does not simply still exist in the United States, it is still *rampant* in the United States. And of course minorities are racist too, the only difference between their racism and the racism of the majority race is that the majority race has the power to to actually act on their racism which results in...well a very long, bloody, and unfortunate American history that has been a constant struggle by all those who were not white males to get equal rights.

Is it unfair that whites are censured for racism far more than any other race? In a strict sense yes, I suppose. However given they (and I use they in a very loose sense as without many American whites who rise above ingrained racism there would be no minority or women's rights) are the majority race and have proven that it cannot be taken for granted that such sentiments will not escalate into something causing real harm to minorities. Maybe in another hundred years when the injustices of the past (and present) are not quite so fresh in people's minds things will not be as they are now.

I could not disagree more. The things listed qualify as racism because they fulfill the 1st definition you listed. Also, so much as you might say the majority race finds it easier to act on their racism, I believe that clear observation demonstrates otherwise. Affirmative Action makes it so that, all other things equal, a person from a minority race is more likely to be admitted to any given institution of higher learning than a person of a majority race. Black History Month implies that we should celebrate the contributions of blacks (and only blacks) for a month, to the exclusion of all other races (we do not have a hispanic history month, or even a white history month). The NAACP works to further improve life for people of color (and only people of color), at the exclusion of people who are white.

When you push to further one given race solely because of their race, at the exclusion of all other races, you are fulfilling definition #1. "Our race has the right to get into college over a member of another race" - while I do not think it is the intention of Affirmative Action - is the statement that is made by its effect.

I actually believe that minority racism is far more rampant in American culture than majority racism, simply because it is viewed as more culturally acceptable. If I were to come out and say I was a member of the KKK, I would be shunned, most likely beaten and abused in every possible way. If I were to say I were a member of the Black Panthers, while I might not have a huge number of friends, I would hardly be faced by the same sort of abuse.

Organizations and institutions that celebrate race are well and good, but in my opinion they only serve to perpetuate racism. If people continue to set themselves apart from others then they'll only feed into the "us" vs "them" mindset.

And just a random tidbit, I seem to recall some girl who wanted to start a Caucasian Club at a high school and was subsequently harassed and called a racist, so much so that she actually transferred to a new school. This is part of the reason I really don't like racial groups or anything of that sort, because if certain groups can have them, everyone should be able to have them.

I disagree completely. You are completely ignoring the part of definition one that speaks of the view that said race is *superior* to another race Black History month was created for the very specific purpose of bringing to light the contributions and actual history of blacks in the United States since it was not being brought to light any other way. It is a celebration of a history that was repressed by the majority. The only black history I was taught in school was that blacks were slaves and then they were freed and then there was MLK and he was shot. There is absolutely nothing stopping any other race in the United States suffering from the same from working towards the same recognition. Your view of the NAACP is just completely false. I'd recommend you actually do some research on the organization prior to attempting to make any claims that it is a racist organization.

It does not seem you fully understand why such organizations are needed or why something like affirmative action was needed. Nor do you seem to understand the effects of marginalization on human beings regardless of their race. You seem to missing the idea completely that races that have been denied the same rights and opportunities of the majority race and in the case of blacks, suffered centuries of actual enslavement, that 50 years where it's illegal to outright discriminate may not actually solve the problem. As long as the educational opportunities of minorities (and at this point it is really far more of a socioeconomic problem than an actual race problem) are less than those of the majority, some sort of leveling of the playing field is necessary.

Everything in the American culture is geared towards the promotion of the majority culture. The schooling, the standardized tests, IQ tests, values, etc. If a low income hispanic scores less on the SATs than a higher income white person than you are essentially saying that of course the white person should be considered before the hispanic, based on merit. Completely ignoring the fact that the white person has all the tools necessary to do well on the SATs while the hispanic person does not. Such a view seems extremely unaware of the reality of American culture and is predicated on the idea that everyone has equal opportunities.

I believe that affirmative action should be shifted to be more focused on socioeconomic class rather than race as we have reached the point where enough minorities have escaped poverty (which is a huge driving force in inequality) that to continue to base it on race makes little sense. But I do not agree with idea of abolishing it entirely. It is still needed to give people a leg up.

You can believe what you like in terms of which racism is more or less rampant. There is little point arguing that. I would be curious to see a study in terms of how much discrimination the average white person faces and how that has harmed them compared to the average minority.

And there would be a reason you would not be looked on as disdainfully for joining the Black Panthers given that while they were initially founded on the idea of black power and racism they changed their views as a more diverse group joined until by the time they became inactive they viewed the idea of black nationalism as black racism and tried to move away from it. Meanwhile the KKK remains classified as an extreme hate group prone to violence against its ever growing list of inferior classifications of people. Not really a very good comparison all things considered.

While we all have the right to our own opinions, you might want to brush up on a bit of history and take a look at some of the more interesting anthropological studies out there involving this issue before cementing yours. It's a pretty interesting subject

Agreed.


Also, once in highschool, the principal came on the speakers and asked for all African American students to report to an assembly in the auditorium. Imagine what would happen if there was a caucasian-only assembly...

Oh, and you people need to write less, if its more then what fits on my screen, no way in h-e-double-hockey-sticks that I'm going to read it.

To summarise for the people with short attention spans: Racism bad

A couple stories that may or may not be relevant.

I have this buddy named Jeremy. We've been friends for quite some time. My older brother was a pallbearer at his dad's funeral. Anyway, Jeremy has a nickname that he absolutely hates. He has a few facial scars from an accident when he was very young and they vaguely resemble tiger striping. At some point he was given the nickname 'Tigger the N*****' by another friend who like Jeremy is black. The name stuck and other of his black friends started picking it up and using it. Jeremy positively despises it. He tried telling the people who use it this but none of them would listen. The typical response was 'What are you ashamed of your skin?'. Jeremy told me once that yes he is ashamed of his skin but not because of its color. He doesn't like be called a n***** by anyone no matter what race they are. The reason he is sometimes ashamed of skin is because he doesn't like being reminded constantly that his face is disfigured by scarring.

Because that story was a bit depressing here is a lighter one. My buddy Junior went on the Ricki Lake show about 10-11 years back. The topic was 'My Family Is Mad Because I'm Dating a White Girl'. Of course it was a load of BS. Junior's brother was also dating a white woman and Junior's mom loved his girlfriend. They went because the show paid for their airfare, set them up in luxury suites, gave the women free make overs, and gave all of them limo chauffeured shopping trips. The funny part is Junior is the spitting image of Chris Rock. We've always kidded him about it. When he was getting into his limo someone at the hotel mistook him for Chris Rock. A crowd gathered and his limo was mobbed so badly security had to call police to break it up.

If you honestly think he wasn't addressing a specific group of people when he said "you".. then I think... well I don't know what to think. I guess I'm just done for now. This thread makes me sad because people don't see this little "speech" (that was not made by Michael Richards) as the racist propaganda that it is.

i lost a college scholarship, because a person with lower scores was of an ethnic background would that be racist towards me?

There are two types of racial discrimination relevant to this discussion. One is what we normally call 'racism' which I don't think I really need to explain. The second is discrimination designed into a system to attempt to 'even' it out because one race is perceived as 'behind' another.

Neither type is all that good, as they both promote cross-racial hatred.

Some people posting in this thread seem a bit blind to the first, and some to the second.

I also know there's a technical term for each of the two types, but I can’t recall or find it at the moment.