It has four legs.

Not a snake.

It's a dragon, I think. Europeans saying that dragons are evil. Dragon eating it's own tail, evil consuming itself.

What if mortal offerings only created a buffer for the ascendant while fighting over the Domoths? They each have their own pool of essence, and after they go up, offerings can be made at their obelisk or cairn or column or whatever, and the essence cost of their presence and other demigod skills will come from that first. If they're killed or retreat back to the Havens, the offering pool goes away.

Or rather than being temporary like that, have the ascendant have a secondary essence pool at all times that only works up there. No "goes away after they go up." If you make sure the essence value is a lot lower than the value of what's offered (10%) it's fine, and the demigod can't use it for their own powers.

One other issue that randomly came to mind:

Giving vernal and true ascendants the same spheres doesn't do much to separate the two. If anything, it seems to reinforce the idea that a true ascendant is just a free vernal ascendant.

What if the people that benefitted from the blessings were different for each type?

Vernals:
15 minutes--blessing (as above) for one guild for one month.
60 minutes--blessing (as above) for the org for two months.

True:
15 minutes--increased or negated power of the corresponding karma blessing for one month (so, if the war throne is held for 15 minutes, you could either boost it to 20% damage boost or make it completey non functional.)
60 minutes--blessing for the Ascendant's cult or a chosen race for two months.

The fact that there are people out there who may think that this system should only involve Demis and Ascendants is what irks me and brings me to claim petty superiority. In my opinion, the system should not be wasted on such a minuscule minority of players - how many Demigods do we have? How many Ascendants can we have maximum? How many people are NOT Demigods or Ascendants? The ratio is likely gigantic, if you put it in to perspective of Lusternian population. It opens up facets of growth for a tiny amount of players - I don't think such a small thing attracts enough peoples to justifiable rope it off for Demi+ only.

If this is an attempt to fix conflict, it's a shot in the dark that missed by about an inch. That is to say, I like the idea - just not the 'no mortals allowed!' club aspect of it. Sorry, but if this generates PK (which would put Lusternia's brilliant (and unique even amongst IRE) combat system to a nice exhausting use).. I'd think it would attract and retain more players if everybody was allowed in. So what if it isn't special? If it addresses a bleeding wound of a problem, I think we can make the sacrifice.



Charmlessly aggressive is a nice and neutral way to put it, sure. I'm yet again putting out an opinion in my own words - however abrasive they are, it's still a valid bit of input from a customer and player of Lusternia who happens to think that the system is flawed. If that tiny aspect was changed, I'm very sure it would be a nice step in the right direction to fix a problem that not only this customer but several others happen to be waiting eagerly to see patched up.

Also, I am well aware nothing is set in stone, but honestly? I don't want to see this turn in to another 'could have been a big help, but we'll implement it in a fundamentally problematic way and never budge on it' issue. In my opinion, Lusternia needs to steer away from megabuffs and go for something else. +3 random stat seems a little too good (and unweighted seems even worse, dear god), for instance - however, the ability to neutralize discretionary powers seems like a very excellent solution to them. I strongly, strongly, strongly suggest that these stay in (in some way, shape, or form).



EDIT: Also, Morg's avatar is an ouroboros (or ouroburi) - a sign of a snake or other demonic creature eating its own tail to symbolize an unending loop or circle aka eternity. It was also used in alchemy - specifically, I believe his is called the synosis?

I wasn't even going to bother answering this. I thought surely one of his followers would recognize the ouroboros and point out what it was...

Well, really there isn't a difference (IC) between a vernal and true ascendant. Also, I don't want to get too complicated by creating spearate systems for each.

For those who are "outraged" that we are catering to a small group of players, well...tough patooties! Heck, we'd close down a third of the guilds if we weren't open to supporting small groups of players.

When we were considering player god systems, the designs and proposals were much more complicated (code-wise) than this straightforward system is. Plus we decided to expand this system to include demigods precisely so more people can get involved. No, we're not going to "open it up" for the entire playerbase--think of it as a goal worthy for those who are interested in pursuing it (if you're not interested in bashing to Demigod, then this obviously isn't a path for you).

However, some ideas for players helping Ascendants sound interesting (though I really dislike the idea of players being ghosts floating around the Domoth Realms--that really should be only open to Demigods and Ascendants for the rp reasons that have already been mentioned before).

Keep the ideas coming (especially specific domotheos blessings)!

My opinion:

The cities with demigods already have an advantage over the others. This merely widens the gap between say...Celest and Mag. I've disliked th idea of special elite little areas that only a special few get access. Other people do plenty for the game RP wise and such. Why are the bashers getting the special treatment? I don't know. I love that the Admin are working hard to give us something new...but I think it's just not goint to work.

Ah, the smell of controversy. I'm going to mouth off a little, since everyone else seems to have been doing it.

I'll admit, adding an ascendant/demi-only area would seem a little unfair to everyone level >99 as Demis already have Havens, and not all of us have the patience and/or desire to bash that long... but when you think about it, what the could mortals really do up there? The thrones are only for Ascendants to use (and as is being shown, the admins are still working out the details). I don't see the Domoth as being new bashing areas... new elite PK, perhaps, but not bashing... or having any new quests, honours or otherwise. The only person (or sort of person) who I'm sympathizing with is Caffrey, because he's mapped so much of Lusty already and I can understand wanting to see all the nice, shiny new room descs for the Domoth. But if that's all you would want to do - sightsee - I'm in favor of the idea (I forget who suggested this, Ilyarin maybe?) that a Demi could take someone up there at the cost of additional essence drain.

See it as the "no mortals allowed!" club, if you so choose, but do remember one's already existed (The Havens) for a long while already. If a Vernal Ascendant can gain the entire support of their city's/commune's ruling council INCLUDING the 1 million nexus drain, they should be able to get someplace none of the rest of us can, because such a feat is a diplomatic nightmare in and of itself. And as for the True Ascendants, with only Ilyarin to use for example, that was a very long and demanding event that led up to Ayridion's Ascension, and they should similarly be rewarded for putting so much time and effort into the game. As for Demis being allowed... well, they're the only bashing type of player that would be allowed into the Domoth.

And that's my little rant, relevant or not.

No, the OLD one was an ouroboros (three of them entwined, as a matter of fact). This new thing has legs. It's not a snake.

It might be a Dragon, but it's definitely not a snake! That's why I was asking what the creature itself was actually intended to be.

I agree 100% that mortals should not be allowed in the Domoth. That doesn't mean, though, that they can't take part. The more I think about it, I don't necessarily like the idea of demigods being able to raise shrines or anything. However, it would be interesting if there was one 'weak' point where mortals could get closer than anywhere else. For example, an obelisk of sorts on Astral that can be tuned toward any of the ascendants (or possibly demigods). To tune the obelisk might require a quest, procurement of various resources, etc.. The type of resources would be important; I was thinking along the lines of things which are in relatively large supply, but might be defended by someone. For example, maybe you need to fill a vial from one of the kephera vats, or bring back the head of the lord of the catacombs, or similar sorts of things. The people tuning the obelisk would not know what resources were needed until they perform some action to begin the tuning, which would display a worldwide message of some sort so everyone knows it is being attempted and can prepare to guard the resources. Once the obelisk is tuned, it might reduce the essence loss in the Domoth for the ascendant/demigod who is going there (maybe as much as cutting it in half for the tick and for sitting on the throne). This would make it possible for demigods to make it there if they have a lot of support, and encourage mortals to get involved in the conflict and fight over it a bit. It's time-limited in that it is only useful when an ascendant or demigod is planning to go and compete for a throne, it is not forced for anyone and doesn't really hurt the 'losing' side any. It gives us something to fight for, gives demigods a better chance of getting involved, and doesn't really hurt the demigod/ascendant conflict in the Domoth at all.


EDIT: @Xenthos - the ouroboros is not always a snake, though it usually is. A lot of the time it's a snake, but it can also be depicted as a dragon or something similar.

Because I'm so irritated with my boss I could stab someone in the eye with a crayon, I'm going to see if I can spend my lunch hour thinking of anything decent for the empty spots. Here goes, my additions in bold.

These are all pretty craptacular, I'm sure, and someone will probably point out how craptacular they are within moments, but ah well. Maybe they'll be helpful in some way and it's distracted me long enough that I am no longer in danger of appearing on the news in some sort of disgruntaled employee slaughters idiot boss news story .

Your opinions are read and valued. These threads wouldn't exist if we didn't want feedback, and yours is certainly useful however you choose to couch it. If you don't like the moniker, feel free to prove me wrong about it.

Maybe if there was a way for a single mortal explorer to get there via a quest. They wouldn't be able affect thrones, and they wouldn't be able to fight due to stun/damage/neurosis/afflicting/whatever they get just for being there. If they're there for 50 minutes, they start to get warning messages. If they don't have the exit quest done before they've been there an hour, they're torn from the area and thrown somewhere (astral?) with epic levels of neurosis. That way anyone can explore if they really want to, but they won't affect the quests, and you'll really have to want to be there to go.

You can influence to demigod, trust me. So its not just the bashers.


Estarra said no mortals, so that means just that. I don't think it matters how we package it, when Estarra says something, she normally doesn't go back on it.

So if it is no mortals, even though I really like Acrune's idea of a big quest just for mortals to at least scope out the place. I don't think they will allow it.

As for the throne powers, I am still trying to think of some, but to the people who don't want them megabuffed. You need to think of it like this.... If someone is to burn a whole ton of essence, the buffs need to be worth it for them to even bother to do it. I am sure you can complain to an ascendent about not getting you these "buffs", but I am pretty sure no ascendant is going to burn essence just to appease their city if the buff isn't worth it.

As for things like a harmony throne buff, say that it gives a 10% increase to exp. Would this stack with the harmony cave/karma blessing? If not, things like this may not be great since alot of people always try to get a harmony karma blessing, and they would just be wasting their karma if the harmony throne buff did the same thing but did not stack. Same would go for any of the karma blessings. They would need to be able to be stacked with the other "throne" buffs. If not I can see some of the people complaining that ascendent A got their org a "soandso" buff, while 75% of the org already had it as a karma blessing, and just voided out the karma each one has spent on the blessing. Unless maybe it suspends the karma blessing countdown times or something so that the blessing will continue when the "throne buff" has expired?

But on the plus side, things like this will perk interest hopefully. I know I've got renewed interest just from anticipation. Which means you might get a lot of your titans/demis back. Also it encourages people to achieve this status as well as learn to fight or at least to survive/help since this area will draw conflict. Of course, there are also foreseeable downsides, but you take risks when adding new things. You'll eventually learn to trust Lusty's coders/admins. They make mistakes of course, but rectify them asap and it helps them do things differently in the future. (See release of bard guilds all at once and now how we're releasing monk guilds one by one) They're not perfect, but I wouldn't have anyone else running Lusty besides them.

@Rodranter sorry, forgot your name. Anyhoo, I forgot what I was gonna say too. Oh that's right. 33 people are demi/titan. 21 being demi's. This includes the semi active or anyone not taken off the list for inactivity. That's quite a handful. Bigger than many guilds as Estarra has mentioned about catering to small groups of people.

I know it is being said that mortal access is very unlikely, but I have to try. I mean, if you don't ask, you don't get, right? So I think either of two ideas mentioned would be really great.

1. Allowing an ascended/demi to escort a single mortal to the area at the cost of an essence drain, with random afflictions/quick astral insanity, for the mortal, while he/she is there.

2. Allow for mortal access via a quest (which could be limited to certain times such as when Aapek is in a particular sign) with a big penalty for being there, like maybe a XP drain in addition to afflictions, or an uncurable affliction which will always cause any mortal who goes there to die after say one lusternian day with a larger than normal XP loss.

FYI, whatever we do, as Lusternia's official mapper, you'll definitely be given the opportunity to run around the area to map it!

There ya go Caffery!