You're in enemy territory.

It's not going to BUG itself!

It'd be cool if it did. I wonder how many bugs Avechna would file.

You're forgetting about third parties. Say Talkan and Derian are fighting and Talkan kills Derian. I don't really have any good reason to be involved in their conflict, but I want to kill Talkan, so I defend Derian and now I can run over and attack Talkan without worrying about suspect.

Looks like Avenger is broken for Duum. Anisu's demesne was hitting me despite her claiming that she hadn't defended anyone/declared me.

Avenger IS broken, and I have a log to prove it.
Rika was in enemy territory, I attacked her.

Krellan defended her.

highjump krellan

Your action causes the nearly invisible magical shield around you to fade away.
You change your mind as Avechna whispers in your mind an inquiry on whether you wish first declare aggressions.

This is not how it should work.

You sure you weren't an enemy of Duum? killing the deformed men and woman would make you an enemy.

Actually, killing the Dread Lord makes you an enemy.

He's not even worth any experience. Or gives anything at all, beyond enemy status.

I was enemied for killing the hooded men and women.

Never saw the dreadlord.

Incoming bug report:

Sender: Avechna

Message:
It happened again guys! That brat that was picking on novices? You know the one. Anyway, so I send one of my hunting avatars after him right? Watching the battle from my mountaintop abode I saw my ruthless avatar close in on his prey. Then, like, with no warning, he KILLED THE WRONG PERSON! No freakin way, right? I seen it with my own eyes, don't tell me it doesn't happen! Oh, and I might as well take this oppurtunity to mention AGAIN that that jerk that keeps jumping people at the Aetherplex is STILL untouchable by me because he's messing around with the Defend/Declare code and I just can't seem to pin anything on him. You guys have to do something about this, I'm going crazy up here!

Message Ends

Issue 3
===
It is trivially easy to completely ignore the Avenger system when jumping people for whatever the hell spurious reasons you want.

Problem A: Someone I want to jump for no good reason, insufficiently good reason, or just to be an arsehole walks through Faethorn/an aetherbubble/a public manse. I can go and kill them and they are screwed. gg.
Solution to A: I don't think there is a solution to this because the admin have stated they want the non-prime planes to be like this. This kind of sucks, but oh well.

Problem B: The above, but with a solid amount of good bashing areas. Especially vicious because good bashing areas are offprime to begin with.
Solution to B: This one is easier to fix. Make it so you can only be autodeclared and killed in an area if your killer is associated with that area. This makes it possible to bash places like Shallach (clearly a bashing area) without getting ganked for it if, say, a Celestian is passing through and feels like getting suspect-free kills. This obviously covers villages and orgs, but Shallach, Presidio, Shallamurine, Arthar'rt and others would all be neutral. If people want to jump others there they can go the extra mile. Potential problem: Kephera and Illithoid. I am not sure how to treat these two areas. I'd like to lean on the side of caution, but unlike places like Shallach and Shallamurine, protecting the mobs there can actually matter for an org's interests.

Someone on Visaeris' thread suggested this, and it seems like you could alternatively solve these problems by applying it elsewhere: how about killing regular mobs is fine, but if you kill quest/named mobs you get enemied? Wouldn't apply to villages or places orgs legitimately protect (i.e Celestia.)

That's not how it works, and I know because I was playing around with this yesterday. If I enter Serenwilde and get attacked by Krellan, and then leave, he can still continue to attack me for the next few minutes and I do not get suspect on him if he kills me. The only time the defender would have to declare in this situation is if that defender DIDN'T attack me while I was in enemy territory; so if Alianna bumbled along after I left Serenwilde to join the fight, she'd have to declare me and thus I'd get suspect on her if I died (assuming I hadn't declared any other Seren, in which case she could defend them.

Hrm, how'd I miss that post from Shammy?

Yeah, attacking someone in enemy territory is in all ways identical to typing declare, and has been for a couple years now.