I demand you contest for Seneschal. I know you are not old enough, there is no real reason to contest or anything, and really Kinson is not doing that bad a job, but hey we need at least 3 elected seats to gain a point a day. So contest and get us that seat!

But I can't handle Seneschal and Chieftain.

Also, I'm still buggy.

I'm not sure a hit of 100 for this is really fair. If an otherwise upstanding Mes'ard son marries a scummy d'Murani woman who tortures faelings and eats sprites for breakfast and PKs random Seren newbies the only option available to the Mes'ards appears to be lose 100 honour to avoid losing a nearby figure over time for all the said newbies she's killing. This denouncing seems to be an honourable action, not a dishonourable one - and I can't see anyone kicking someone out of his family so they can PK newbies and then going through the year-long process to get them back (or does it not work like this? If not, it could.)

Yeah, and it's not really a wonder that Talnara is ahead by so much because half of what d'Murani does, it gets no credit for whatsoever. Yay non-dynamic mechanics.

Honestly, I do like the idea of the house honour system, but it's mostly just made problems for me/my side of the d'Murani family too. I've had to basically say to screw the family (honour), because Gloms can't offer or endorse a Magnagoran god, or endorse Magnagora in general.

So, if anything could change, can we at least try and combine multiple or secondary org affiliations into great houses? Otherwise, no one will ever catch up with Talnara. If someone has an iron grip on something like first place, what's the point in even trying?

I have no idea if the size of the penalty is too great. Truth is, as I don't expect to ever be in a Great House, I never really paid attention to the amounts. I was just saying it makes sense there should be some penalty, but this particular penalty might be way too much, sure.

I am not disagreeing with there being a penalty. There really should be some means to keep people from just going crazy with "I don't like all these members. *disown*"

But 100 points, hell even for the Talnaras who currently generate the most honour is a lot of honour to recover for getting rid of a bad apple. It is nearly impossible to recover from for a family who loses 7 points a week because they only have one elected seat and so therefore are penalized by an awful system.

Not like that'll help. That'll just mean that if you ever overtake us (and being 2-org gives an advantage in size and available seats to fit on, for obvious reasons) which seems inevitable, it'll be a case of no one ever overtaking you. This comes back around to existing greathouses being able to build up a huge amount of honour in advance that decays extremely slowly precluding anyone else who comes in later from overtaking it in a reasonable amount of time.

Upon implementation, the honour system looked great... but now that it's been out for awhile and the glaring, ugly, puss-filled flaws are coming to light, perhaps it would be a wonderful time to re-evaluate the system and make it smooth and gorgeous like a viscanti-baby's bottom?

Taking off from Gwylifar's concept in another thread about families spread across nations, I would like to see this implemented and the family bonuses for being most honourable not be -most honourable in the basin- but being most honourable in a nation. Then change the name from Honour to Influence, some people might find it purely semantic, but others find it derogatory seeing their family as "dishonourable".

If d'murani is most influential in Magnagora they get an influence bonus, if Talnara is most influential in Serenwilde they get an influence bonus, if Trader Bob's family shows up and is most honourable in Serenwilde and Magnagora and Glomdoring it gets an influence bonus.

Make a display like village politics and put the family name beside it for who is the most influential in that city/commune

Celest Nobody
Serenwilde Talnara
Magnagora d'Murani
Glomdoring d'Murani
Ackleberry Nobody
Halifax Nobody
Gaudigaugh Nobody


Heck you can even make it for the more orgs you are most influential in, the influence bonus improves.

It is my humble opinion that this Family Honours System is a complete and utter joke placed into the game to cause even wider rift between players, and sadly even between good friends. Damn it's not April's Fool. The opinion still stands. This system was not thought through thoroughly and completely by those who placed it into the game. When you include a system which takes away more points, than one can feasibly attain, you are doing something wrong. Why foster and encourage an environment where players have to, and are forced to tear each other down, even when they are supposed to be on the same 'side'.

Begone with this terrible and completely unthought out system. Throw it into the bin. If you must replace it with something useful and beneficial and joy providing to players, then have instead something which does not calculate Honour and Respectablity with some sort of numbers. That is absolutely ridiculas. Throughout history and even today, honour and respectability are often associated with some of the largest crimimal families of the World.

Instead, include a system of Reputation. Allow families in Lusternia to build up a Reputation towards a certain achievement or accomplishment. Something which they can say, look, our family is the most ruthless families in the Basin. We have killed more enemies than anyone else! We are excellent combatants. Or, let them be able to say, look, our family is the most literary families in the Basin. We have more writers and artists in our family than anyone else. Thus we're more intelligent. This kinda of system, to gauge actual achivements and compare them against others would be so much more beneficial to us all, and allow for plenty of friendly competition amongst families. There are many options open here, Families could be politically influencial, monetarily powerful, maritime bosses of the aetherspace, artistical masters of the Basin and so much more.

Again, trash the Honours System, bring in the Reputation System. Make everyone happy.

I like that idea, but it would have to be implemented alongside other things like a cut in the cost of disowning, banner houses having better ways to get honour (and thus...do something...) and so on.

It would cut the culture thing though, what would you do with that?

EDIT: That was at Gregori, not Neuf

In all honesty there is enough things for culture bonuses, do we -really- need another?

If there must be some Org boost as well, why not look at something less powergaming and more RP like... I would offer suggestions but it is 7:30am and I haven't slept so my creativity is limited... Where did that Gwylifar go?

Oh, I was responding to Shiri, not you, on that point.

And I don't feel that qualified to propose a different approach because I haven't kept up on learning about the current one (because as I said I don't expect to ever be involved in one). I just putter about in the thread tossing out historical analogies because a lot of these conversations forget to consider the real-world history of great houses, and I find them very informative.

Of course I'm very sympathetic with your position, having gotten yourself deeply embedded into something based on the promise of what it would be, then finding out it wasn't that, long after you're too deep in it to change track. I sympathize with that a lot. Doesn't mean I have a tidy solution in my back pocket though! If I think of one, I'll offer it.

Also not sure that what's already there might not be closer to what it should be than you think, once a few changes are made. It's still new, and Lusternia has always been good about (eventually) making changes after real in-game experience revealed the problems. So while digging for ideas, don't get too full of despair.

While some of the suggestions on the thread are very interesting, I'm not sure the admin will replace the entire system. A quicker and easier way of solving what seems to be the current problem is:

1. Lowering the cost of outcasting. 10 or 20 would suffice; no call to go to 100.

2. Give everyone more ways of gaining honour, so that people can stop being annoyed because they're listed as Dishonourable.

3. The org should still get the culture gain, I think. When you count the fact that "player activity", which seems to be based on login time and should be considered fairly OOC, counts for culture, it's pretty much a no-brainer that family honour should too.

Changing the name from "Honour" to something else like "Influence" might also help. It's surprising how often the name you call something has a profound impact on how people react to it, as much as what the thing itself is. (Words matter. So does their beauty.)

"More influential" is, in its way, more accurate anyway, particularly when you consider how many meanings of "honour" there are, and how they apply differently in the different cultures of the Basin.

Trouble is, all the good words are used. Influence is a skillset, Prestige is what you get when your book wins, Esteem gets put in bottles, etc. How about Preeminence? Renown? Glory? Stature?

That's only half the current problem. The other half is that 2 out of 3 of the Great Houses and more on the rise are multi org families in a system that caters heavily to single org families.

I personally have an issue with the whole "omgz we gotta adoptz more for pointz!" turned into role play
Not being active in any family on any of my alts, I can't sympathize per say, but it sounds like bullbananas. As soon as the Great House thing went into effect every one and their mother/sister/brother/husband has tried adopting me. Its infuriating. I am usually quite particular about what type of family I join, and it sucks when I have to narrow it down from EIGHT because everyone wants Great House, as opposed to three really good decent families, and trying to figure out which category each perspective family is in. rawr.

So... want to be adopted? We need to recover 100 points.

lol noooo
I refuse to be adopted into families with more then 10 people really. I had a problem in another IRE where I was adopted into a family that consisted of 80% of the citizens in the city. Really hampers some things.

Steady on, old chap.