The purpose of this thread is not to provide a perfect solution for balancing Player Versus Environment. I don't even know if it's possible to do so completely, but there are a few things to consider before we start:

1. We can't raise or lower the health of people to balance bashing. This would have a direct effect on PvP, which we want to avoid.
2. We don't want to nerf warriors or monks. There are people that went warrior and bought runes just to maximize hunting. It would be unfair to take it from them.
3. We want as small a change as possible. It's more likely to be implemented, and it's less likely to have outlying or unexpected side effects.

My Idea
Make guardian symbol strikes, druid cudgels, wiccan moonblasts/athames, and mage staffs hit twice in quick succession, like a bonecrusher or blademaster does. For example, the geomancer could unleash one blast, twirl their staff for cosmetic affect, and immediately unleash another blast. The formula which calculates the amount of damage done by each blast would have to be altered to do less damage. Maybe about 30% less than it does now. The point here isn't to increase the base damage being done too significantly, it's to increase the number of critical hits. The reason I don't say to cut the damage exactly in half is because these classes are ALL less tanky than warriors. I think it's fair that if we can't survive as much, we should be dealing a little more damage. The damage output needs to be slightly more than a Pureblade or an Axelord, since, like I said, they can survive more, the flimsier classes should deal some more damage. What I would hope to achieve with this implementation is for guardians, druids, mages, and wiccans to be on the same bashing level as Pureblades and Axelords. I don't think it would be a big deal if bonecrushers and blademasters were still a little bit better.

I wouldn't implement this for attacks like cosmic fire. Bashing isn't too lopsided until 80+, when crits start to matter.

Now, we have two options for how this would affect PvP. Either you just keep attacking players the same as it is now (one blast, same damage), or you alter the cosmetics to be exactly the same as the new vs. mob type attack, two blasts, but using a separate formula that makes each blast to be exactly half of what it is now, so that nothing is changed in terms of PvP. It wouldn't matter that you're doing two hits now since crits don't affect people.

A few other things to consider: why are mages right now better bashers than druids or guardians? I'm not really sure, I've never been a mage, but someone told me once it was because of utility abilities they had, or something. Maybe they have something that raisers their DMP more? Either way, maybe guardians and druids could have a 5% higher attack power than mages?

You may have noticed that I didn't mention bards. I'm not sure how much needs to be changed about bard hunting. It isn't bad by any means, especially if you have acrobatics, and illusory self is an excellent utility. If these changes put bards at the bottom of the totem pole, though, they might need the same double-type attack that I described.

One final comment: a look may need to be taken at some of the damage formula's for certain mobs. I, and I'm sure other people, think that some mobs hit way too hard post-DMP.

I like the idea to have the basic attack of all the guilds, barring monks and warriors, have an extra attack on denizens. Maybe base it on some kind of reverberation on them not having a shard. I think the second attack should be base entirely on your level. That way guilds with basic attacks of various strengths can benefit equally without overpowering some and cutting others short.

Do you have any RP rational for items hitting twice?

Also, what about axelords and trueblades?

Do you think axelords and trueblades are bad bashers? I think their a nice place to balance it to.

Do you have any RP rational for items only hitting once?

Why can't you guys just hit faster and/or harder?

... does one need a declared rp reason for being alive also?

Faster would affect PvP, but harder would work fine. The amount of damage people do in PvP and PvE use different formulas.

They allready do hit harder... the point is criticals, which is only affected by the amount of hits per second, not the amount of damage done per second.

Hitting faster would necessitate a change in equilibrium recovery. Not that I wouldn't mind absolving people insanely fast, I think other people would. XD

Harder would be fine, but I don't know how much harder we would need to hit to balance out the amount of critical hits/tankiness warriors have.

@Daganev: My point exactly. This doesn't need a reason.

Well hitting faster doesn't necessarily break anything, I myself can't remember a time when I was just staffed/cudgeled/fired to death, but hey who's counting.

I only meant bashing attacks btw.

I can see it now... mages wielding pitchforks so that the blast comes out three at a time...

actually wait a second, the auto double hit would be unbalanced.

You would have to have two separate balances for each attack, you couldn't just have a double attack.

Yes please, i think the only way to solve this is to half the eq time for minor second.

Yes it does.

You have a single arm, doing a single attack. You have a single weapon, doing a single attack.

Now you suddenly want your revolver to fire two bullets at once? its not possible.

doesn't 1 staff critical = about 3 of my normal criticals..

No, I want to pull the trigger twice without waiting a few seconds.

@Krin: There is no point arguing that warriors and monks aren't better bashers. There's not a single person here who agrees with that.

@Sojiro: Sorry, didn't realize what you meant. Yeah, if only bashing attacks were sped up some, that would probably have a desired effect, since we do hit quite a bit harder.

Mages are better bashers because of reflection I believe BTW.

That would go under the, "hitting faster" request.

I think Sojiro meant just faster than it is now, not right after. I was describing an effect similar to a blademaster double jab.

lvl 1 - 85 -- Mages/Guardians/Wiccans bash better
level 85 -100 -- Warriors /monks bash better

Its just a trade off. If you want to be an uber basher, you start of in your youth as a young ideolgue learning about the ways of the inner workings of the world, and then in your old age you slow down, and just pick up a stick and hit things over the head.

It works quite nicely actually.

That isn't a fair trade, and you know it.