See, I don't have issue with the idea of tweaking it. Of addressing the cost issue (which I do agree with, btw). Of adding things to it (such as the nifty idea of custom paper or letters).

What I have an issue with is the idea that 'no one' uses books. That 'no one' writes or reads them. That 'no one' uses libraries. That these things, that I really enjoy, are worthless because, apparently, they can't be used in a fight and there are other (uglier - who wants to write a play or a multi-chapter story on a freakin letter??) methods of getting the work out there. I have issue with the idea that Bookbinding should be deleted, because IMO, that would get rid of one of the most awesome aspects of the whole game. Not everyone thinks that battle is the be all and end all of Lusternia.

And me! I've been a bookbinder since I started playing, even though it would be impossible for me to use the Magic Tome (I need both my hands for wielding). I'm working on a number of books write now, one of which I hope to be a REALLY long work. I won't give up bookbinding for a better skill, just like I won't give up being a squishy Trill warrior, because I love to RP. I tried for the longest time to get books put into the Serenguard library, and even managed to get a second bookshelf built.

Aside from the pamphlets on new skills, there has not been a single addition to the Serenguard library since I was the GA over 7 RL months ago. In fact, we've pulled stuff out because some of the things just work better as GHELP scrolls that everyone can look at quickly.

I just wish the whole system wasn't so redundant, and, perhaps backwards. In most other skills, the higher you get, the better the abilities become. What does bookbinding get? As we go higher, we get to make larger books... that no one uses. Finally, we get to learn Divine Script... which is almost only used in events. And we get to copy books, for reasons I can't yet figure out. I've only seen it done once or twice. And then we get a good Trans ability, if you can use it, but we have to go through a whole bunch of abilities that aren't used first. It's backwards.

Again, who wants to write a play or a multi-chapter story on a freakin letter?

Here's my great epic poem, it's over 5,000 words and follows the tragedy of Princess Marylith, I worked on it for over a RL month.

Let me write on a letter.

No. I don't think so.

And who wants to go to the library to read something and checkout a letter? Really?

The most common requests for books I get are journals and books. I got a few special commissions some months ago for bigger books for the Serenguard, but other than that, just books. How often do you use the other skills in our skillset? I agree that Lusternia would be a different place without books-- but other than the that early skill and the scrolls, the rest of the skill makes little contribution to Lusternia because it's not used. I'd rather see the skill made into something useful, not necessarily for battle (which wasn't my implication, I'm sorry if it read like that), but just something that will be -used-.

I'm a fan of more options, not less. I'd rather there be larger books available for the one or two people who want to use them, than for there to be only smaller books and those one or two people having to make due. I said that I'm all for addressing the gold outlay issue and that would, I think address the ''no one' wants larger books' issue as well. They are expensive, I get that. But other than that, I don't think there's a single thing wrong with having larger books available.

Remove the News Boards for the most part and require cities to have a bookbinder produce a newspaper?

You know, that would be really awesome.

I'm not sure how it would work - how would people post? Would the posts need to be edited? Would the paper be updated automatically or would posts be stored for a 'monthly' update? Would readers need to subscribe? Could they subscribe to other org's papers? - but it would be cool.

I've never used anything longer than 20 pages, and can't imagine using anything longer than 20 pages, though I'm sure that some of the true epics at least get up there to 50. I mostly play Lusternia because of the library and culture system, but even I dropped bookbinding in favor of jewelry because bookbinding just wasn't all that useful, except for a handful of things.

I've always wanted to see stationary in Lusternia, and the contracts idea is cool. I agree that the gold outlay is one of the roughest (and oddest) points about bookbinding.

The posts would be made, and each month, a newspaper would be generated, but the city would have to get a Bookbinder to produce copies of it with the skill "BOOKBIND NEWSPAPER" at the printing press for 1 wood, and 500 gold inlay. The Visitors Centers in each city would thereafter be used to sell said newspapers.

First page would include an index to each news post in the paper.

I dunno.

It's already hard to get people to read the news.

The gold outlay would probably address alot of concern, I agree. If I remember correctly it has already been lowered once and is still ridiculously high. I do not know though if that would increase the demand for, say, a codex. This is why I think the skill is unbalanced. In other skills, the higher abilities are generally more powerful or in higher demand. In bookbinding, in the different types of books, as you go higher the demand drops off significantly. For example, right now I put lessons into Bookbinding so I can get EncantedScript and Disruption. But do I need to go higher? Will I ever have to bind a tome, omnibus, or copy a book? Maybe a couple of times, but IMO it is not worth the large expense to get an ability that will be used so infrequently. I think the skill is built to make sense in some ways, but in practice, it doesn't work like it should.

I don't want to lose any of the books either, but I think the skill needs to be rearranged and redone. I'm working on a couple ideas now, I'll post them when I have some.

And just to clarify-- I want bookbinding to succeed too, for the same reasons you do. I just think the skill could be done to better enhance and add to the Libraries and literary RP

Clans could get contracts with Bookbinders to produce newspapers which would be need to be mailed to members. This would provide a function for Dues as well! You could request that you recieve the news, and you would have your fee for the newspaper put in your yearly dues.

Yeah, the stationary and contracts thing that the OP suggested are awesome. I'm all for that too! And reducing or removing the outlay too!

I'm just not for taking things away from the skillset (except the outlay). Add things, don't take them away! Except the outlay. That you can take.

Oh please... don't eliminate the newsboard and make it all done by bookbinders... if clans and orgs want to do this, by all means, please do so! But I fear that if we forced it to happen this way, no one would ever know what was going on. Good idea in theory, bad, bad one in practice.

Yeah, you're prolly right about that. It would be awesome, but I can see how it could create all sorts of issues too.

Single page books are never as readable as books spread over lots of pages, and you can't shelve a letter.


Edit:

It is comparatively easy to compare combat skills because the main criterion by which a skill is judged is efficiency in killing. People may select guilds for slightly different reasons - for RP suitability, the activity of the guild, etc - but skills aren't generally compared on that basis. The main factor is how OP they are.

With tradeskills, I'm not sure it's so clear cut. The premise of Everiine's posts has been that the determinative criterion of a good trade skillset is the ability to turn a profit. I don't agree.

Why don't I agree? Well, because plenty of people with trade skillsets don't have them because they want to make money. Making money may be a factor somewhere down the list, but it figures below other concerns such as:
- convenience;
- the ability to design;
- combat bonuses;
- roleplay suitability;
- and so forth.

Although it might be possible to establish tradeskill parity in one of these aspects, it will never be possible to do it in all of them and there is, in any case, the risk of making tradeskills incrementally vanilla as a consequence of the equalising process. I think Avaer's ideas for bookbinding are really brilliant, but I don't think that because it will make them more balanced or fairer, because I don't think it's possible realistically to draw comparisons when the determinative factors involved in choosing a tradeskill can be so diverse, rather I think they're brilliant because they'll add zest and interest to the skillset. As bookbinding stands, I can see that it doesn't turn a profit, and I can see that it may seem weak under certain criteria; but it doesn't under others: plenty of people take it because they like to write in game and it's convenient, or because they enjoy submitting bookish designs. Consequently, I don't see any particular necessity for a redesign.

I haven't thought this edit through - I've just typed as points occurred to me; in 10 minutes time I may have changed my mind. So take this post in the spirit in which it was written - an impromptu polemic designed as a discussion point rather than from any deep seated fundamental belief which you may wish to rebuff or rebut.

Doesn't Achaea have a city-newspaper option? I know -some- mud does, and it's somewhat like a small town paper, complete with gossip, jokes, short report, etc. Would be a fun option.

Nothing stopping us from doing it here either, someone just needs to organize it. The mechanics are there that it could be done if players do it.

Well, the implied suggestion behind my remark was that bookbinders could get this as an ability.

I believe that both Serenwilde and Magnagora have some sort of regular journal, although they're reviews of books and plays rather than being current affairs based.