Narsrim2009-04-22 19:31:38
QUOTE (Jack @ Apr 22 2009, 03:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
(However it does seem from an outsiders perspective that this is a case of "it was fine when I used it, but it's terrible, teddible when you guys do".)
It is fine when you use it against people who largely aren't impacted by it because it's not doing anything. It's a totally different story when it is doing something. No?
Xenthos2009-04-22 19:54:47
QUOTE (Narsrim @ Apr 22 2009, 03:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think this is largely an asinine point. It doesn't matter when something is addressed. If it is broken, it is broken. Likewise, I'm not sure when you became so oblivious to the idea of perspective, but allow me to spell it out: it's much harder to determine the impact of something when you only see one side of the equation. Most of Glomdoring is immune is fear. Thus using fear aura against them didn't really enlighten Malicia or anyone else to how impacting it can be. This is why I have the most difficulty fighting classes I've never been, but monks (who are very powerful at the moment) don't dent me.
That being said, I'm not sure what expectation you have. Malicia has complained about this for a while, and she recently created this thread. Are you insinuating that if she posted the first time she had issues with it, people wouldn't be drilling her? I think not. In fact, the administration has openly said on many occasions it prefers for things to be thoroughly tested and examined over time.
That being said, I'm not sure what expectation you have. Malicia has complained about this for a while, and she recently created this thread. Are you insinuating that if she posted the first time she had issues with it, people wouldn't be drilling her? I think not. In fact, the administration has openly said on many occasions it prefers for things to be thoroughly tested and examined over time.
No, I'm saying that trying to defend the timing in the way you're doing it is a loss. Just shrug it off and stick to the point you're trying to make.
And... it was obvious to me the first time I used it that it was far more effective against Celest than Serenwilde. I rarely bothered turning it on against Serenwilde alone, unless Xiel was there. Seren learned the same thing against both us and Magnagora. And it was being used against people who it "largely impacted" (Magnagora), earning complaints. By both Celest and Serenwilde. Again: Your defense here is a loss. Stick to the point and realize that the timing is going to appear suspect-- there's no real way around that. But it doesn't really matter if you cover the actual points themselves well enough.
Furien2009-04-22 19:58:15
I have to agree, you never know (or, rather, won't acknowledge or complain about it) it's broken until it has been used. And in that case, 'it was never complained about before' is no justification. Nobody claimed GreatPent needed a nerf until Thoros kept himself eternally locked in a room with 45 guards with a few friends, slaughtering them all. Nobody complained that guards were too weak until that happened. "Sure, they're dying really easily, but they did their job just fine before, they don't need to be fixed!" isn't a very sensible justification.
Would people have complained about BatBane had it not been used to pull of guaranteed Bard instakills? It may have been 'on the list' for an eventual nerf, but its importance on The List rises greatly depending on how often it's used. If they used it to just keep a person in Octave easier, most would care less, since they're not seeing the truly overpowered side of it.
Would people have complained about BatBane had it not been used to pull of guaranteed Bard instakills? It may have been 'on the list' for an eventual nerf, but its importance on The List rises greatly depending on how often it's used. If they used it to just keep a person in Octave easier, most would care less, since they're not seeing the truly overpowered side of it.
Narsrim2009-04-22 20:04:23
QUOTE (Xenthos @ Apr 22 2009, 03:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No, I'm saying that trying to defend the timing in the way you're doing it is a loss. Just shrug it off and stick to the point you're trying to make.
And... it was obvious to me the first time I used it that it was far more effective against Celest than Serenwilde. I rarely bothered turning it on against Serenwilde alone, unless Xiel was there. Seren learned the same thing against both us and Magnagora. And it was being used against people who it "largely impacted" (Magnagora), earning complaints. By both Celest and Serenwilde. Again: Your defense here is a loss. Stick to the point and realize that the timing is going to appear suspect-- there's no real way around that. But it doesn't really matter if you cover the actual points themselves well enough.
And... it was obvious to me the first time I used it that it was far more effective against Celest than Serenwilde. I rarely bothered turning it on against Serenwilde alone, unless Xiel was there. Seren learned the same thing against both us and Magnagora. And it was being used against people who it "largely impacted" (Magnagora), earning complaints. By both Celest and Serenwilde. Again: Your defense here is a loss. Stick to the point and realize that the timing is going to appear suspect-- there's no real way around that. But it doesn't really matter if you cover the actual points themselves well enough.
I think you're neglecting that when used against Magnagora, it was also being used against us and while was therefore annoying, but at least we were both suffering so the overall impact was less.
Narsrim2009-04-22 20:06:24
I also want to say for the record I don't have Fear Aura. I've never used Fear Aura. Malicia, bless her heart, isn't what one would call active nor is Desitrus.
People seem to be assuming or implying this is being used constantly by me/celest, and it's really not. I've raided twice with Malicia in the last month. I haven't raided with Desitrus in a long long long time.
People seem to be assuming or implying this is being used constantly by me/celest, and it's really not. I've raided twice with Malicia in the last month. I haven't raided with Desitrus in a long long long time.
Xenthos2009-04-22 20:07:38
QUOTE (Narsrim @ Apr 22 2009, 04:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think you're neglecting that when used against Magnagora, it was also being used against us and while was therefore annoying, but at least we were both suffering so the overall impact was less.
It was? Thoros was active with Fearaura for how long?
I certainly never defended Magnagora when you guys were raiding, so there was no fearaura on their side except for his very brief Ascendant-hood, excepting Domoth battles.
Narsrim2009-04-22 20:10:28
QUOTE (Xenthos @ Apr 22 2009, 04:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It was? Thoros was active with Fearaura for how long?
I certainly never defended Magnagora when you guys were raiding, so there was no fearaura on their side except for his very brief Ascendant-hood, excepting Domoth battles.
I certainly never defended Magnagora when you guys were raiding, so there was no fearaura on their side except for his very brief Ascendant-hood, excepting Domoth battles.
I have no idea, but it was at least a couple weeks. How often do Malicia/Desitrus raid? Almost never. It's not something that's been used nearly as much as you seem to assume.
Celina2009-04-22 21:30:27
For the record, I specifically remember it being "fine" when Mags ranted about it months ago, and I think I remember Malicia being one of the people that lol'd in our faces. Gregori isn't terribly off base with that part.
Not that the change of heart really matters. Fearaura has been ridiculous from day one, would love to see a change. Shuyin's (aka my) suggestion is perfection.
Not that the change of heart really matters. Fearaura has been ridiculous from day one, would love to see a change. Shuyin's (aka my) suggestion is perfection.
Malicia2009-04-22 21:48:54
QUOTE (Celina @ Apr 22 2009, 04:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
For the record, I specifically remember it being "fine" when Mags ranted about it months ago, and I think I remember Malicia being one of the people that lol'd in our faces. Gregori isn't terribly off base with that part.
Not that the change of heart really matters. Fearaura has been ridiculous from day one, would love to see a change. Shuyin's (aka my) suggestion is perfection.
Not that the change of heart really matters. Fearaura has been ridiculous from day one, would love to see a change. Shuyin's (aka my) suggestion is perfection.
Don't mistake me with you. Things aren't 'fine' so long as I can abuse it. That's your spin. First off, Magnagora and Celest have the same defenses against fear, with the exception of lumuti. Magnagora waiting 10,000 years to raise an Ascendant who could use fearaura just as effectively against Celest has nothing to do with skill balance.
I have never applauded the fact that SW was immune to fear, just because icly, Celest and SW are on decent terms. I didn't realize that I could only present an idea/thought/suggestion based off of IC events. That's Gregori's belief. I have always mentioned how silly I felt fearaura was and that it was rather baffling that one of the -best- abilities in Ascendance can be ignored by communes for the most part. Is it really so hard to digest the notion of balance?
Fearaura needs to be removed or affect everyone similarly.
Shaddus2009-04-22 21:54:10
Remove fearaura, give ascendants an aura granting allied people 5% faster attack speed if they are in the same room.
:shrug: I got nothin'.
:shrug: I got nothin'.
Celina2009-04-22 21:54:58
QUOTE (Malicia @ Apr 22 2009, 04:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Don't mistake me with you. Things aren't 'fine' so long as I can abuse it. That's your spin. First off, Magnagora and Celest have the same defenses against fear, with the exception of lumuti. Magnagora waiting 10,000 years to raise an Ascendant who could use fearaura just as effectively against Celest has nothing to do with skill balance.
I have never applauded the fact that SW was immune to fear, just because icly, Celest and SW are on decent terms. I didn't realize that I could only present an idea/thought/suggestion based off of IC events. That's Gregori's belief. I have always mentioned how silly I felt fearaura was and that it was rather baffling that one of the -best- abilities in Ascendance can be ignored by communes for the most part. Is it really so hard to digest the notion of balance?
Fearaura needs to be removed or affect everyone similarly.
I have never applauded the fact that SW was immune to fear, just because icly, Celest and SW are on decent terms. I didn't realize that I could only present an idea/thought/suggestion based off of IC events. That's Gregori's belief. I have always mentioned how silly I felt fearaura was and that it was rather baffling that one of the -best- abilities in Ascendance can be ignored by communes for the most part. Is it really so hard to digest the notion of balance?
Fearaura needs to be removed or affect everyone similarly.
Hey, whatever floats your boat. If you have to lie and sling a little mud to find balance, more power to you. I'm just happy you have seen the light...well, for fearaura at least.
Malicia2009-04-22 21:55:22
Celina, find a post where I'm going 'lol, fearaura is fine.' If you can't find one, shut up. Or better yet, please come up with an argument to refute the statement that Celest and Mag are on even grounds as far as fearaura is concerned. I'm not interested in a flame fest. I thought I was pointing out a real issue and of course, for the most part, you have Glom/SW players whining about wolf totem and coming up with theories as to why the subject came up, as if it's any mystery or even relevant. I'm sorry I don't hold every conversation concerning skills over forums. I prefer chatting over ooc clans with envoys and the like.
Celina2009-04-22 21:57:21
QUOTE (Malicia @ Apr 22 2009, 04:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Celina, find a post where I'm going 'lol, fearaura is fine.' If you can't find one, shut up. I'm not interested in a flame fest. I thought I was pointing out a real issue and of course, for the most part, you have Glom/SW players whining about wolf totem and coming up with theories as to why the subject came up, as if it's any mystery.
Why is it that when I use your tactics, you get all huffy. So unfair.
Malicia2009-04-22 22:00:59
Most of the time if I need to quote you, I do and the proof is always there. I don't have to make it up.
Celina2009-04-22 22:07:48
QUOTE (Malicia @ Apr 22 2009, 05:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Most of the time if I need to quote you, I do and the proof is always there. I don't have to make it up.
I'm just messing with you, Malicious (that was supposed to be malicia+delicious, but it came out wrong). Maybe it was you, maybe it was Gregori, who knows. I just wanted to poke at you. Return the favor and all that.
(No you don't)
I'll stop trolling now. Nerf Fearaura!
Malicia2009-04-22 22:08:29
Thanks!
Unknown2009-04-22 22:20:47
Doesn't Totems have a MASSIVE advantage even with the forced-movement-change proposed thanks to almighty Rock?
I like the change Wolf to act as 50% fear resistance (doesn't drop, has message). Or the delayed-run as Shuyin proposed, whatever.
I like the change Wolf to act as 50% fear resistance (doesn't drop, has message). Or the delayed-run as Shuyin proposed, whatever.
Xenthos2009-04-22 22:24:56
Honestly, the rad-thing they're suggesting disproves their "Some people have immunity to it so it is unfair!" argument. Summon immunity is, for Demigods, a distinct possibility (or close enough to immunity, at least). Especially when you add in Rock, Rooting, Red, etc.
Malicia2009-04-22 22:29:28
QUOTE (Xenthos @ Apr 22 2009, 05:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Honestly, the rad-thing they're suggesting disproves their "Some people have immunity to it so it is unfair!" argument. Summon immunity is, for Demigods, a distinct possibility (or close enough to be immunity, at least). Especially when you add in Rock, Rooting, Red, etc.
How's that? It doesn't have to work exactly like rad, Xenthos. Could work like planar flux, for all I care. You're thinking way too much. I'm not looking for an advantage to one/two sides. If that were the case, communes would still be in a better position, especially those with trueheart, rock, rooting and are demigods. It isn't as if demis are restricted to one or two orgs. Size needs a looksee as well, but that's another topic.
I also -love- how you're downplaying the situation with the 'Some people have immunity' comment. It isn't some people, it's nearly the entirety of two orgs.
Xenthos2009-04-22 22:32:29
QUOTE (Malicia @ Apr 22 2009, 06:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
How's that? It doesn't have to work exactly like rad, Xenthos. Could work like planar flux, for all I care. You're thinking way too much. I'm not looking for an advantage to one/two sides. If that were the case, communes would still be in a better position, especially those with trueheart, rock, rooting and are demigods. It isn't as if demis are restricted to one or two orgs. Size needs a looksee as well, but that's another topic.
Size is actually up for a hit on the current envoy report (yay), but not one that'll hit summoning. And that was my point-- making it check summon resistance is just changing who has the immunity around a bit, but it's still leaving immunities.
Edit: And to your edit, nearly an entirety? You're exaggerating a tad bit.