Diamondais2009-10-22 00:45:20
We who play the languageless races during that are ed
Unknown2009-10-22 00:49:06
QUOTE (diamondais @ Oct 21 2009, 08:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We who play the languageless races during that are ed
Go go bookbinder?
Lendren2009-10-22 01:08:13
QUOTE (Xenthos @ Oct 21 2009, 07:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Actually, there was some complaining because it went in about 1 hour before Magnagora's Nexus World Weakening and we had the stuff to aim for a 4-Construct Demolition. A fair chunk of power to be gained, given the way the system was set up. But I think that was about the only reason for the complaining, given that all orgs were able to keep 1 Construct. (Having to repay for it was odd, I guess...)
I didn't say no complaining about the change, just not about the lack of an eventish in-game explanation for it.
Everiine2009-10-22 01:14:15
I don't see the point. If everyone in an org understands the language, then it's no different from Common until you try to talk to someone not in your org, in which case you'll just switch to common anyway. Eventually, after the novelty wears off, people will again just use Common all the time because it will be easier.
Fern2009-10-22 02:01:19
QUOTE (Everiine @ Oct 21 2009, 09:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't see the point. If everyone in an org understands the language, then it's no different from Common until you try to talk to someone not in your org, in which case you'll just switch to common anyway. Eventually, after the novelty wears off, people will again just use Common all the time because it will be easier.
Not really, if it's what everybody speaks coming out the portal. I think it adds nice flavor. Yay RP!
Daganev2009-10-22 02:09:31
QUOTE (Everiine @ Oct 21 2009, 06:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't see the point. If everyone in an org understands the language, then it's no different from Common until you try to talk to someone not in your org, in which case you'll just switch to common anyway. Eventually, after the novelty wears off, people will again just use Common all the time because it will be easier.
It allows people to properly and happily play French language elitists.
Kelysa2009-10-22 02:10:17
Everiine probably has a point.
Aerotan2009-10-22 02:11:52
QUOTE (diamondais @ Oct 21 2009, 08:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We who play the languageless races during that are ed
You still would have CT, Tells, and charades. (I'm aware it's not all that great of a replacement)
Unknown2009-10-22 02:27:12
QUOTE (Aerotan @ Oct 21 2009, 10:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You still would have CT, Tells, and charades. (I'm aware it's not all that great of a replacement)
Tells are actually done in different languages as well. If someone is speaking in a langauge you don't know and sends you a tell, it just comes out as gibberish.
On a side note, it'd be nice if, when we send a tell to someone and it's not in Common, if it said: You tell Person, in Language, "Blah," because I often forget that I'm speaking another language when I'm sending tells.
Aerotan2009-10-22 02:39:15
Which is why I specified 'say like commands'. You can't nab thoughts out of the air. You can nab words though.
Unknown2009-10-22 02:58:19
I'd love to see this.
I'd also love to see common removed, but eh.
I'd also love to see common removed, but eh.
Unknown2009-10-22 03:17:57
I think I very much like this idea, I think it would flesh out a much larger amount of roleplay throughout the game. However, I have several problems/questions/changes that might need to taken care of.
First off, and this is significant, think how newbies would be affected. When I first exited the portal and acclimated myself to the controls, the first place I went was literally New Celest, because I had read a bit about it, and in my MMO inclined mind, I naturally assumed I'd be better of getting equipment in a city, as I'm simply more acclimated to the environment, plus, rats are so much more satisfying to kill then weevils. Of course, being from Glom, I was quite unceremoniously told to leave in no uncertain terms, which was quite confusing to me, at least at first. So my first problem lays along the lines of this- Should a newbie wander in like that under the same pretense I did, how in the world will the idea of "you're no allowed here" be portrayed when the vast majority won't speak his language? Wild gesticulating? I understand this is likely a non-problem, but even so, the chance of it happening exists. And I do suppose the Divine may intervene if it does indeed happen in that context, but yes, I digress. I suppose the first solution to that would be (and I am fully prepared to be murdered for this) an addition to the newbie sequence explaining the idea of language, and perhaps even suggesting he/she make their way to their own commune or city.
Second, I think this would put a wonderful possible addition in place in the form of shops, in the vein of the shopkeeper wouldn't necessarily be able to serve customers of every tongue without a bit of training. Shopkeepers would then have to go about insuring their shops are friendly to all languages.
Lastly, how would this work for tells and clans? Or would the plug suddenly be pulled on inter-org relationships?
Either way, a fun idea, and I really like it. Then again, as a bookbinder, I suppose I am required to.
First off, and this is significant, think how newbies would be affected. When I first exited the portal and acclimated myself to the controls, the first place I went was literally New Celest, because I had read a bit about it, and in my MMO inclined mind, I naturally assumed I'd be better of getting equipment in a city, as I'm simply more acclimated to the environment, plus, rats are so much more satisfying to kill then weevils. Of course, being from Glom, I was quite unceremoniously told to leave in no uncertain terms, which was quite confusing to me, at least at first. So my first problem lays along the lines of this- Should a newbie wander in like that under the same pretense I did, how in the world will the idea of "you're no allowed here" be portrayed when the vast majority won't speak his language? Wild gesticulating? I understand this is likely a non-problem, but even so, the chance of it happening exists. And I do suppose the Divine may intervene if it does indeed happen in that context, but yes, I digress. I suppose the first solution to that would be (and I am fully prepared to be murdered for this) an addition to the newbie sequence explaining the idea of language, and perhaps even suggesting he/she make their way to their own commune or city.
Second, I think this would put a wonderful possible addition in place in the form of shops, in the vein of the shopkeeper wouldn't necessarily be able to serve customers of every tongue without a bit of training. Shopkeepers would then have to go about insuring their shops are friendly to all languages.
Lastly, how would this work for tells and clans? Or would the plug suddenly be pulled on inter-org relationships?
Either way, a fun idea, and I really like it. Then again, as a bookbinder, I suppose I am required to.
Fern2009-10-22 03:35:14
QUOTE (Drae @ Oct 21 2009, 11:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
First off, and this is significant, think how newbies would be affected. When I first exited the portal and acclimated myself to the controls, the first place I went was literally New Celest, because I had read a bit about it, and in my MMO inclined mind, I naturally assumed I'd be better of getting equipment in a city, as I'm simply more acclimated to the environment, plus, rats are so much more satisfying to kill then weevils. Of course, being from Glom, I was quite unceremoniously told to leave in no uncertain terms, which was quite confusing to me, at least at first. So my first problem lays along the lines of this- Should a newbie wander in like that under the same pretense I did, how in the world will the idea of "you're no allowed here" be portrayed when the vast majority won't speak his language? Wild gesticulating? I understand this is likely a non-problem, but even so, the chance of it happening exists. And I do suppose the Divine may intervene if it does indeed happen in that context, but yes, I digress. I suppose the first solution to that would be (and I am fully prepared to be murdered for this) an addition to the newbie sequence explaining the idea of language, and perhaps even suggesting he/she make their way to their own commune or city.
You would still be able to speak common, it wouldn't replace common. Just, during the event it might be a bit of trouble, and somebody could just send you a tell or a message if you need to leave an area.
Unknown2009-10-22 05:48:49
QUOTE (Fern @ Oct 21 2009, 11:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You would still be able to speak common, it wouldn't replace common. Just, during the event it might be a bit of trouble, and somebody could just send you a tell or a message if you need to leave an area.
Well, obviously having taken this post the entire wrong way, I suppose your right. But at the same time, I think it MIGHT be an interesting proposition. I mean, don't know how many RL units of measure most cities would be from each other, but I find it at least conceivable that they might have separate languages, much like countries in Europe having separate languages while being extremely close to one another. I think the idea of having trouble communicating is at least interesting. say, something like the Drunk modifier that garbles the speech of non-org members to your ears. Much like a thick accent. Thus making it easier to speak to them if you know their language, but at the same time making it livable if you didn't. This, of course, discouraging common in general. I think that would solve it, no?
Fain2009-10-22 07:29:25
QUOTE (Lendren @ Oct 21 2009, 06:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Mostly I'm just being a smartass. But a little bit I'm saying that shouldn't really be an obstacle. For instance, I might have liked a mini-event to explain why nexus world conflict just suddenly stopped and we lost all our constructs, but did anyone really object or complain when there wasn't any reason why it was that way, it Just Was? Not that I heard. That horse is way out of the barn and I don't think people mind that much.
I agree that in an ideal world there should have been an explanation for the end of nexus world conflict, but it's not quite analagous because it wasn't a change with retrospective effect: there were nexus world conflicts, and then for whatever reason - and perhaps no basin scientist has figured out why - there weren't. That isn't the same as bringing in a language and then trying to pretend that it's always been there, because that's rewriting history, and that sort of thing really needs justification of one sort or another.
Arix2009-10-22 07:57:17
I'm going to go with the 'If something happens, and there's no immediate explanation or obvious cause, Kethuru did it' justification
Saran2009-10-22 08:29:11
QUOTE (Fain @ Oct 22 2009, 06:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I agree that in an ideal world there should have been an explanation for the end of nexus world conflict, but it's not quite analagous because it wasn't a change with retrospective effect: there were nexus world conflicts, and then for whatever reason - and perhaps no basin scientist has figured out why - there weren't. That isn't the same as bringing in a language and then trying to pretend that it's always been there, because that's rewriting history, and that sort of thing really needs justification of one sort or another.
So... common gets sucked out of existence by some random soulless (the races without a racial language should have one anyway and this would mean people would have difficulty communicating during this period) then the orgs perform a series of repetitive tasks that allow those connected to their nexus to speak a unique language. As only those bound to it are capable of speaking it this accounts for people org-hopping and the ambassadors/aides could have an ability to make all org-based speech in that room understandable by anyone in it.
Also don't bookbinders already have the ability to translate books into org based langage? Cause I'm fairly sure my journal is in Moondancer.
EDIT: If people want to play the "but what about the newbies" card. True novices could have the ability to understand and be understood by anyone.
Shiri2009-10-22 08:51:28
That's not "org-based language", it's a magical (<-- important) effect that makes it appear as gibberish to anyone else.
Lorick2009-10-22 10:12:33
I like Shiri's suggestion more, and creating a counter measure for the issue should be in the same vein.
Shiri2009-10-22 11:10:42
Huh? That wasn't a suggestion, that was how the bookbinding ability already is.