Unknown2010-02-13 21:22:31
I doubt any gods are in actual trouble when it comes to essence. If they want to keep a few non 'main' city people, pretty sure they can.
Arel2010-02-13 21:24:54
QUOTE (Shamarah @ Feb 13 2010, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The suggestion that the admin create a new Order-based skill is totally unnecessary. It's also completely ridiculous to expect them to do something like that while they're in the middle of creating guilds for Gaudiguch and Hallifax.
I wasn't suggesting it was something that need to be done right this moment, Sham.
Arix2010-02-14 07:40:33
Just wanted to toss this out there
2010/02/13 00:00:48 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Arix.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Arix.
Seriously,
affinity
2010/02/13 00:00:48 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Arix.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Arix.
Seriously,
affinityUnknown2010-02-14 07:49:57
A 100%-imbued esteem item is worth ~65000 essence. Bashing up the Moors is ~50000. Both tasks are easy to do for anyone over level 30. Order Affinity may make things more difficult, but seriously, it's easy to cope up.
Gregori2010-02-14 08:05:03
The rest of affinity is fine. Lose the passive drain, because not everyone has the ability to recover from it, you know you aren't going to reimburse lesson loss even though after 5 years you have decided to force players to choose their longstanding RP or their new homes with a very flimsy excuse to justify it, and this doesn't turn off if the player is offline meaning you are punishing players for not being on to gather essence to make up for the essence they are costing their Order.
In fact, thinking on it more and thinking on Shuyin's comment about gods essence pools being so large as to not be hindered by this... I would have to say that very little thought was given to this. Orders like Eventru's can still maintain people in other orgs, because he has a large essence pool and the drain of a few people will mean nothing compared to the influence he can hold in multiple orgs VS. Kalikai who is a small, new Goddess with a low essence pool that having members in multiple orgs means it does have an impact on her so she is more likely to be forced to stick within her Org only. As I write this I have to wonder if someone upstairs got told "hey this is a great idea!" while snickering behind the palm of a hand went on.
Note:I wasn't singling out Eventru with any purpose other than he was the first large active order that came to mind.
In fact, thinking on it more and thinking on Shuyin's comment about gods essence pools being so large as to not be hindered by this... I would have to say that very little thought was given to this. Orders like Eventru's can still maintain people in other orgs, because he has a large essence pool and the drain of a few people will mean nothing compared to the influence he can hold in multiple orgs VS. Kalikai who is a small, new Goddess with a low essence pool that having members in multiple orgs means it does have an impact on her so she is more likely to be forced to stick within her Org only. As I write this I have to wonder if someone upstairs got told "hey this is a great idea!" while snickering behind the palm of a hand went on.
Note:I wasn't singling out Eventru with any purpose other than he was the first large active order that came to mind.
Sylphas2010-02-14 09:10:36
Why bother with order RP when it's the same thing as your city/commune RP? At this point order enemy lists and a lot of shrine powers are simply organizational defense with no real tie to the order itself, so why not just stick it all in the org and let order be RP only? I can find absolutely nothing in Maylean philosophy that would preclude non-Seren members. I see no logical explanation as to why a God loses essence for a follower being from a different city. Is their an RP basis to this I'm missing? Gods aren't tied to the org nexuses like players are, they just see a city that might fit their philosophy better and join with it; that doesn't preclude anyone else following that philosophy, just makes it perhaps more likely that those who do are from that org. You've got player bases in the new city that, for the most part, are immigrants; it doesn't make sense that someone would drop everything, religion and all, and flock to Kalikai and Elostian; forcing it mechanically is ridiculous.
Just ban foreign order membership if that's the goal. This just reeks of a passive aggressive way to screw with tons of people's RP.
Just ban foreign order membership if that's the goal. This just reeks of a passive aggressive way to screw with tons of people's RP.
Xenthos2010-02-14 13:34:43
QUOTE (Sylphas @ Feb 14 2010, 04:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
At this point order enemy lists and a lot of shrine powers are simply organizational defense with no real tie to the order itself.
You know, this is very true. And it is even true of some of the "scholarly" orders that people have been complaining about above (Raezon's Order, for example, has recently gotten very very Mag-centric, enemying everyone, etc). This might have something to do with a certain someone wanting to use his shrine powers anywhere, but yeah... that one's definitely not a "neutral" or even trying to be neutral one any more.
Not much point in pretending it is.
Veyrzhul2010-02-14 13:45:08
QUOTE (Alacardael! @ Feb 14 2010, 08:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A 100%-imbued esteem item is worth ~65000 essence. Bashing up the Moors is ~50000. Both tasks are easy to do for anyone over level 30. Order Affinity may make things more difficult, but seriously, it's easy to cope up.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -195000 essence from the spiritual distance of Veyrzhul.
Zalandrus2010-02-14 15:44:08
QUOTE (Veyrzhul @ Feb 14 2010, 08:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -195000 essence from the spiritual distance of Veyrzhul.
What order of magnitude is the essence pool of Eventru at? Are we talking tens of millions? Hundreds of millions? Billions? More?
Xenthos2010-02-14 15:47:02
QUOTE (Zalandrus Meyedsun @ Feb 14 2010, 10:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What order of magnitude is the essence pool of Eventru at? Are we talking tens of millions? Hundreds of millions? Billions? More?
Should be hundreds of millions by now.
Veyrzhul2010-02-14 16:17:16
Not sure about passive income from members, but from offerings alone, I don't think it's that much. Anyway, only wanted to show that it can be more than you can just earn off-handedly each day.
Aoife2010-02-14 16:23:46
QUOTE (Alacardael! @ Feb 14 2010, 02:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A 100%-imbued esteem item is worth ~65000 essence. Bashing up the Moors is ~50000. Both tasks are easy to do for anyone over level 30. Order Affinity may make things more difficult, but seriously, it's easy to cope up.
Certainly. If someone is willing to influence or bash up between ~150,000 and ~200,000 essence every day, a highly invested person could counteract the passive drain. They might even be able to cough up the essence for death-related drains, which as Ixchilgal demonstrated are worth around ~50 - ~150k apiece. It takes Aoife as a level 84 faeling around ~35-45 minutes to go from 0 - 100% esteem, if none of my regular areas are influenced out, so if someone is willing to invest a few hours every day just to break even, they probably can. Of course...if you miss one day suddenly you're down close to 400k...
Eventru has stated that the lack of effect on offering 'value' is a bug, so the people who need or want to take care of their own upkeep will either need to increase their offerings accordingly, or have someone with the right affinity/not in the order do the offering. I'm betting $5 on the latter, in most cases.
Damadreas2010-02-14 16:51:59
This has all but killed my interest in Order's in general. For my side might as well just say they don't exist, too much beauracracy before and now this.
Lehki2010-02-14 16:55:45
QUOTE (Aoife @ Feb 14 2010, 11:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Certainly. If someone is willing to influence or bash up between ~150,000 and ~200,000 essence every day, a highly invested person could counteract the passive drain. They might even be able to cough up the essence for death-related drains, which as Ixchilgal demonstrated are worth around ~50 - ~150k apiece. It takes Aoife as a level 84 faeling around ~35-45 minutes to go from 0 - 100% esteem, if none of my regular areas are influenced out, so if someone is willing to invest a few hours every day just to break even, they probably can. Of course...if you miss one day suddenly you're down close to 400k...
Eventru has stated that the lack of effect on offering 'value' is a bug, so the people who need or want to take care of their own upkeep will either need to increase their offerings accordingly, or have someone with the right affinity/not in the order do the offering. I'm betting $5 on the latter, in most cases.
Eventru has stated that the lack of effect on offering 'value' is a bug, so the people who need or want to take care of their own upkeep will either need to increase their offerings accordingly, or have someone with the right affinity/not in the order do the offering. I'm betting $5 on the latter, in most cases.
And god forbid somebody needs to take a break from Lusternia for a week or more.
Unknown2010-02-14 17:01:39
QUOTE (Damadreas @ Feb 14 2010, 11:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This has all but killed my interest in Order's in general. For my side might as well just say they don't exist, too much beauracracy before and now this.
GG customer relations and player retention.
Aoife2010-02-14 21:32:25
QUOTE (Lehki @ Feb 14 2010, 11:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And god forbid somebody needs to take a break from Lusternia for a week or more.
Well, someone will just have to pick up the slack!
Kiradawea2010-02-14 23:17:19
QUOTE (Sojiro @ Feb 13 2010, 10:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I doubt any gods are in actual trouble when it comes to essence. If they want to keep a few non 'main' city people, pretty sure they can.
QUOTE
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Orabel.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -30000 essence from the spiritual distance of Raikogen.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Celeris.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Fania.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Caleb.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Parabollus.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Shir.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Kurama.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Talya.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Mitch.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Wuylinfe.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Harpuia.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Tetres.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Sram.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Knorrith.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Arian.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Iyoreux.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Sylara.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Kiradawea.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Alysi.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Anaem.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Kreon.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -90000 essence from the spiritual distance of Kiarlea.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -30000 essence from the spiritual distance of Raikogen.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Celeris.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Fania.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Caleb.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Parabollus.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Shir.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Kurama.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Talya.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Mitch.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Wuylinfe.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Harpuia.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Tetres.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Sram.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Knorrith.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Arian.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Iyoreux.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - +1000 essence from the devotion of Sylara.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Kiradawea.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -20000 essence from the spiritual distance of Alysi.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Anaem.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -10000 essence from the spiritual distance of Kreon.
2010/02/14 00:00:35 - -90000 essence from the spiritual distance of Kiarlea.
Total loss. -240000 essence.
Total gain. +13000 essence.
Net. -227000 essence.
Isune is lucky to get one esteemed item a day. Maybe. Since most of the members are, shockingly enough, designers who spend most time RPing or making designs, and not repeating the same command a dozen times for text xp. Truly, Affinity will be the death for us.
Kiradawea2010-02-14 23:27:22
You know, what bugs me the most is that this will in essence make it far more difficult for those orders that are already having difficulties. So long after Godrealms were released, Isune still hasn't enough essence to get her own. At this rate, she'll never get one.
And honestly, I still object to the philosophy behind this idea. Some orders can have a close affinity to the city, like Lisaera and Serenwilde, who has Mother Moon as a common interest, or Magnagora and Fain, who both believe that soulless juice is good for you. But for other orders? The purpose of Isune's order is the search for Beauty. That spans pretty much every single non-tainted org, and even some Glommies who could look past that they lost her in the past could be interested in joining. Raezon and Elostian? The search for knowledge and understanding is universal, and should in no way be limited to just Hallifax and Magnagora.
Sometimes, I wonder if you guys bother to think through what you put into the game at all, or if it is a game of darts that is the final source of decision-making.
And honestly, I still object to the philosophy behind this idea. Some orders can have a close affinity to the city, like Lisaera and Serenwilde, who has Mother Moon as a common interest, or Magnagora and Fain, who both believe that soulless juice is good for you. But for other orders? The purpose of Isune's order is the search for Beauty. That spans pretty much every single non-tainted org, and even some Glommies who could look past that they lost her in the past could be interested in joining. Raezon and Elostian? The search for knowledge and understanding is universal, and should in no way be limited to just Hallifax and Magnagora.
Sometimes, I wonder if you guys bother to think through what you put into the game at all, or if it is a game of darts that is the final source of decision-making.
Unknown2010-02-14 23:28:42
Anyone able to tell me how much Elostian's multi-city order is losing from this?
Sylphas2010-02-15 00:17:12
If you're dead set on tying Orders and orgs together as tightly as possible, it needs to be something you do with RP over an extended period. Dropping Affinity on us overnight was absolutely not the way to do it.
