No-Lynch in an open setup like this is not bad at all, and anyone who says anything otherwise does A: not have a firm grasp on the mechanics of the setup (which is understandable), or B: is aware that a No-Lynch that is strongly in favor of townie interests and is trying to throw the majority off.

I used to be like Shiri, I believed No-Lynching was horrible and that the mere suggestion of it was scummy. But I have come around and seen the light. Hallelujah. We honestly cannot deduce a great deal today with what we've been given. No-Lynching isn't as messy as say, lynching the Shirimeister for instance.

I plan on doing my SPIN thingie tonight. Xavius (or Saran), if you are a sweetheart and not an evil-scum-chibi, I would not advise investigating me tonight. It will be interesting to see what happens. Maybe the scum will "keystone" me (the tenchi role looks hideously overpowered by the way), or maybe they will do nothing and try to paint me as a target, or maybe I will simply be killed to be gotten out of the way early.

Please, everyone, lets vote No-Lynch and move on to the night phase.

Okay, now I've completely lost the thread between Bali and Xavius. If you guys want to give us a no-lynch, explain why no-lynch is good.

Especially you Xavius. I still want you to explain the "less attacks" part. Trackers can look for those who shouldn't be moving sure. But how many nights until they perish. Remember that Kanako has a kill that we can't stop, no matter what.

And the argument about us being patient could still backfire. Town should know what to do each night, but so too will scum. They'll be able to calculate who they should target first. And they'll be able to decide who gets to live and who gets to die. Explain it. Explain why this is such a good idea. Because until I get a good explanation, I'll be placing my vote on someone.



This. You've gone on a crusade against everyone who has as much as glanced sideways your direction. You haven't explained anything that's been brought up regarding you, and have instead counterattacked everything in a very aggressive manner. Your whole playstyle is so utterly different from the one you exhibited last game, and in other games too. Remember when you were a survivor and still presented yourself in a manner almost like a sacrificial lamb to protect an important townie? Yet this game you're jumping down the throat on everyone for suggesting that you're a danger to town. It does not fit. Especially that last sentence. I won't have to justify myself. You've given me plenty of justification already, because that's what mafia games are. You lynch those who you think is scum based on the information you have at hand. The information we have at hand is a skittish nightvig who makes everyone who looks oddly at him out to be scum, actions that go completely counter to how he acted the previous game.

Sorry Xavius, but I'll be needing some good reasoning to move this.

Vote: Tekora

And Bali. Your spin only targets one person. It does you no good to protect Shiri if scum goes to kill Gleip instead. Seems you have it confused with Youmu's ability.

I don't know why you're apologizing to me. I still haven't voted no lynch once. My vote has gone from Gleip to Shiri, because Shiri's trying to kill us all.

As for explaining, if you can't be bothered to read and/or ask specific questions, I can't be bothered to deal with your posts.

That doesn't explain the "less attacks" part. I want that explained.

There. That's my specific question. I thought that was clear? Anyway, I want that explained, it might not move my vote, but it could make me get why you're willing to take this risk.

Our doctor/roleblocker/jailkeeper can't protect from Gleip and a lynch, and they know better than to protect from Tekora when acting on public information. Of course, this is also information that the arsonist would love, being able to avoid dousing targets that die to other means.

If we follow Shiri, four people die tonight and one becomes lost in the death timer. That's 14 to 9. This means that I need to research shatter tonight and I need to be protected so that I can use it or we lose unless we get really lucky.

Let's also not kid ourselves about the need for luck here. We don't know. We have lots of lovely, shiny tools and lovely, shiny information to work with, and Shiri wants you to throw it all away. What's especially suspicious is that Shiri doesn't even want us to use our kill abilities wisely. Dayvig today means no dayvig when we actually know something.

Somehow, somewhere, I'm getting this funny vibe that Bali wasn't kidding when he said Xavius is scum. Perhaps it is only because it appeals to my odd brand of humour.

Bali asking not to get investigated just seems to be begging for an investigation. It's like those admin messages telling you not to do something, because it will cause a bug, and it is being worked on right now.

It's hard to decide a vote. I can see things going either way for Tekora or Shiri with what's been happening. Or maybe Xavius is just good at being convincing.

Oh I'm not approving of Badgerboy's killemall strategy. But I don't like a no-lynch either. Especially since our dayvig is itchy on the trigger, and our nightvig is skittish as a Skitty. And you'd probably want to research shatter tonight or tomorrow night anyway. Alice and me are the two people you want to focus on first anyway. An extra shatter and investigate would be invaluable.

I haven't voted no-lynch either. I just don't want Shiri saying that a no-lynch vote is a scum tell and then swinging momentum towards nuking the playerbase. If you made it that far, you and me agree.

Can we get an up-to-date votecount?

I'm siding with "no lynch is a bad plan" but agreeing that killing as many people as we possibly can is also likely not the best plan. Again, more in depth later.

Fine. If it will shut Kiradawea and Shiri up, I'll explain myself despite Xavius having done it already.



When I said this, I addressed the fact that you have no idea what order Silferras might post the deaths in, or the flavor text, or who killed who, unless you're watching someone. And you're not the Watcher. Thus, suspicions were raised. That's what happens when you claim to be able to do something that you shouldn't be able to.



I said this because it's true. Like Xavius said, I can be roleblocked or jailed. Gleip can't. I can't kill someone with my power AND make a mafia kill the same night. Gleip CAN kill someone during the day and make a mafia kill that night.

You say that I'm playing completely different than I have in other games, would it make you feel better if I aggro'd the hell out? Because I can totally do that based on what Shiri's shown so far. I mean, at this point, I'm thoroughly convinced at this point that the only reason he's coming after me so hard is that he's intimidated by me after what he saw me do last game. It's not lost on me that I'm high up on the Scum's hit list right now. Add that to the fact that Shiri's showing his classic scum tell of posting long, drawn-out diatribes and using lots of words to say nothing while trying to befuddle the facts (remember what happened during Pokemon Clone Mafia), tells me that he has something to hide.

Unvote

And Kiradawea? I always act in the best interests of the town at my own cost. That's why I'll save my vote for the hammer on Shiri, just in case he's Suwako.

But just to piss Balizar off...

FOS: Shiri

Aggro enough for you, sweetie?

@ Tekora
1. Your posts are actually longer than mine, mine are quite clear in what they're saying, and you can tell this from reading the posts, because I know you have that ability. -1 for trying to obfuscate the situation.
2. That is actually an acceptable explanation for why Gleip could be more dangerous, I guess. It's too late now, though, because you gave off so many scum tells along the way. Maybe I'd've been more interested if you said that when I asked it instead of ostensibly waiting for Xavius to figure it out for you after you committed to it.
3. I wasn't watching last game. What did you do (preferably from a neutral bystander please!)
4. Your first paragraph of reasoning is terrible. You can just lie your arse off about who you targetted unless you suspect watching/tracking is involved. What's gonna happen, the scum is gonna contradict you? Sure, there's a risk, but it's way more obvious who Gleip killed.

@Bali:
I do not understand why you think Tenshi is overpowered. She looks like a plain old serial arsonist to me. I.e, the scum role that is so bad Silferras was forced to not actually use that power when she got assigned it in Xavius' game in order to win. Also, lynching me - or anyone else for that matter - is actually still better than lynching no one because then you discover that Xavius and Tekora are full of and can kill them off tonight. Obviously it's a retarded move relative to lynching someone actually worthwhile, or possibly lynching two worthwhile suspects (this is where not flailing randomly and selecting your targets based on the thread comes into play), which is why I'm not recommending doing that.

Was your "even though Xavius is scum" comment serious, by the way? Do you think he sounds it? I'm confused since you seemed to make that conclusion and then (apparently seriously) voted no lynch.

I also wouldn't recommend trying to call out who the watchers should investigate. Maybe my valuation is off here but I think that like usual, letting the scum know what they can plan around is still more counterproductive than letting the watchers know what to plan around is productive.

I have tried to think of something sane to add to this discussion, without referencing cake.

Until then, I guess Tekora looks slightly more eviler. Or not. (I was about to calling you Tekkie, I'm sorry)

I'm sleeping as long as I can, until I make sense. Consider this my post for tommorrow.

"I think this should be right!" Vote Count
Siam - 1 (Gleip)
Shiri - 1 (Xavius)
Gleip - 1 (Romertien)
Tekora - 2 (Shiri, Kiradawea)
No lynch - 2 (Bali, Arix)

With 14 alive, it's 8 to pass a vote!

Been away for two days. Will read what I've missed.

In response to your PM (since your inbox is full and this isn't sensitive information) - yes, activating your power at night means that everyone is roleblocked, and said night will end without anything else happening, including kills.

Thank you! (for clearing that out and reminding me my inbox is full!)

90% sure I already unvoted.

if not, UNVOTE

Shiri, Gleip, Xavius, and Tekora are all sending out scum tells.

On the other hand, we only have three scum, so at least one of the above is actually not scum.

I am forced to conclude that since we're all arguing with each other, "scum tells" should read as "are actually posting content" there.