The problem, as I see it now, is that there is a perceived imbalance resulting from those on the moral high ground not being willing to do anything necessary to win, whereas those with "different" morals couldn't care less. If it truly is an imbalance of the RP, then we can solve it ourselves, eventually.

The real problems come in when it is mechanically impossible, such as influencing undead, or when the Divine attempt to intervene and force players one way or the other.

Yes they do. Xenthos even said that Glomdoring is at war with the kephera.

Glomdoring just dislikes the kephera because they killed Crow. We welcome Kephera into our homes if they prove themselves worthy. I'm pretty sure if Illithoid attacked Crow, we'd start disliking them too.

Yes, so you do support one side.

Yeah, I was really upset when they put the illithoid and kephera representatives in Gaudi and Halli. Was hoping they could remain neutral on the matter or let the players eventually decide, but adding those guys in is clearly an admin push in the direction they want.

You probably will have to eventually choose. I doubt they'll allow both Harmony/Stealth users. But I'm pretty sure Halli and Gaudi both would pick Stealth over Harmony. I know I would hands down.

^--- example of why it is easier to play a "bad" character who plays by their own rules than it is to play a "good" character with morals.

I was telling Rika to help the Illithoid over a clan. Would have been really funny from my perspective.

Who says "good" people need morals. I could be a completely zealot, murderous Celestian. It's just that your Star Council and Moonhart Circles prevent you from doing such on the grounds of 'morals'.

We had somebody like this, once.

His name was 'Narsrim'.

Amaru?

I would have to disagree.

We heavily support the Illithoid; not because we really like them or care about them (I mean, we recently unbanned the hunting of Illithoid) but because they are the most effective tool in a campaign against the Kepherans.

We're pretty much the only ones who did anything on the Illithoid side of this event, heh. Primary reason: Kephs wanted one thing, we want to see them dead. Die, evil bugs, die.

But that's only because they killed Crow, and they only killed Crow because Glomdoring was seclusive and wanted no part in the events!

Because not everyone wants to RP "we'll do whatever we want and twist anything to fit that" characters, and neither Serenwilde nor Celest has evolved that way over time to any great extent. This whole argument is absolutely ridiculous. Sure, we can do whatever we want. But I'm playing a role-playing game, not a "get the high score and WIN WIN WIN" game.

Events pushed you in a direction you didn't want to go? Welcome to our world! Heh.

Man, you have no idea. I was (futilely) pushing a pro-keph stance before they went all pyro on Glomdoring. Icky soulless. That's different, though. Skills were being given out along keph/illithoid lines, and I don't think they wanted Mag to be the only ones with Stealth.

@Sylphas: Celest was definitely that way at one point. It was very successful while doing so. Most people were very happy with that success. Art is born from peace, and their raging crusaders brought peace to Celest. Pre-Glomdoring Serenwilde was a fairly brutal place too. So...yeah, history fail.

Oh no, I'm pretty sure most of us wanted to go in that direction. The issue here is more inline with the problems people had with TBC.

Events pushed us in a direction we didn't want to go, sure.

ICly, we were much more interested in helping the Kepherans up until they attacked us (part of the reason they did, I imagine).

However, we rolled with the punch and it's shaped a huge part of Glomdoring's roleplay ever since. On an OOC level, it's actually one of the events that I enjoyed the most; it was definitely one of the most formative (in a positive way), because of the way we took it, shaped it, and used it.

It has been, ever since then, a really good incentive for getting involved in any of these UV things; not because we like the Illithoid for some random reason (the Admin fobbed them off on us and that's the only connection), but because the Kepherans are actually our enemies.

Okay so lets ignore the whole rest of the post in which I clearly stated that Serenwilde has for its whole existance and in its history clearly done what is best for Serenwilde.. damned what other people think of their actions. No matter how harsh or undesirable they may seem. There are five billion points in Serenwilde's history that can be referenced to to allow the influencing of illithoid. The current group just chooses not to. Its not a bending of rp. The current crop of Serenwilders simply don't want to say hey its totally possible for us to do this because x, y, and z happened in the past when we did j, k, and l. And thats cool. You can do such. But lets not pretend its any different than anything that has been done in the past.

We talking from the history histories, or the modern histories and what players have done? If you're talking history histories, I'm going to say that you're full of it.

If modern histories, after asking some older players who've been around Serenwilde for ages what they thought would have been decided back then, I was told that "Anyone who considered it would be considered a traitor to nature." "And probably killed."