Neos2010-08-14 00:59:19
QUOTE (Noola @ Aug 13 2010, 08:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Am I the only person who keeps up with threads that I've already started reading no matter how long they get, but if I've been away for a few days and suddenly there's a 20 page thread, I don't bother with it?
Possibly, there are several threads that I refuse to read until I can get the time to sit down and read through all the pages I missed. Hell if I had the time I'd be going through a lot of the 100+ threads and reading through them. I also tend to re-read things constantly.
Everiine2010-08-14 01:05:08
QUOTE (Sojiro @ Aug 13 2010, 08:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Many recent problems would have been solved had the admin at least made a thread on the forums titled 'This is what we're gonna do' before major changes occur then asked for feedback.
That way, no one gets blindsided, whatever potential problems (not all of them, of course) can be addressed, and everyone ends up a bit less stressed.
That way, no one gets blindsided, whatever potential problems (not all of them, of course) can be addressed, and everyone ends up a bit less stressed.
But why? I am of the belief that the Admin don't need our approval for anything. They have to decide what is best for the game-- players care about what is best for them (me included). That is their job. Yeah, it makes people angry. But that's life.
Unknown2010-08-14 01:19:29
I didn't say approval, I said feedback.
Example:
-Admin posts a draft of the skills list for Illumination or at least general ideas
-Random player points out the lack of an entcall skill
-Admin can check it out and add it before it goes in, saving players months of hassle
Example 2:
-Admin posts about the demigod system along with potential essence costs
-Players point out that some costs are way too high
-Admins take this into consideration and can act on it, saving ragequit kneejerk comments all around.
Example:
-Admin posts a draft of the skills list for Illumination or at least general ideas
-Random player points out the lack of an entcall skill
-Admin can check it out and add it before it goes in, saving players months of hassle
Example 2:
-Admin posts about the demigod system along with potential essence costs
-Players point out that some costs are way too high
-Admins take this into consideration and can act on it, saving ragequit kneejerk comments all around.
Unknown2010-08-14 02:37:58
QUOTE (Everiine @ Aug 13 2010, 08:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
See, I see it in somewhat of an opposite light. I believe that players overreact to anything that they don't like. We have really great Admin around here-- our voices are heard more often than we admit, and the admin do a pretty good job of connecting with us. The downside is that when they do have to do things that the players won't like, the players react under the false premise that the players have some control over the game and should have an equal voice in decisions. We don't. We shouldn't.
The keg rune is a great example of this. From the players' perspective, they were gypped out of a powerful artifact with no warning. From the Admin perspective, the players had been abusing a major, major bug without telling anyone. Then the players have the nerve to publicly post over and over again how they will work hard to find ways to circumvent (read: cheat) the system. If I was an admin, I would have banned people for that. Overreactions from everyone.
Could the administration do a better of job of status updates, emails about ongoing requests, things like that? Sure, probably. Would be nice. But I don't think it's nearly the major issue people are making it out to be, considering that a number of people have admitted that, over the past few years, the Admin have greatly improved in the customer service department.
The keg rune is a great example of this. From the players' perspective, they were gypped out of a powerful artifact with no warning. From the Admin perspective, the players had been abusing a major, major bug without telling anyone. Then the players have the nerve to publicly post over and over again how they will work hard to find ways to circumvent (read: cheat) the system. If I was an admin, I would have banned people for that. Overreactions from everyone.
Could the administration do a better of job of status updates, emails about ongoing requests, things like that? Sure, probably. Would be nice. But I don't think it's nearly the major issue people are making it out to be, considering that a number of people have admitted that, over the past few years, the Admin have greatly improved in the customer service department.
I also believe most players will overact, but I don't think I'm overreacting. If ever player overreacts, is does NOT mean that they don't have legitimate concerns. When your child says, "I'm starving," it doesn't mean you say, "You're overreacting, I'm not going to feed you." The same can be said here. I think some players actively try not to overreact.
Secondly, the past is past. I don't doubt it's true that the services are better than they were before, but why should that line of argument ever be accepted? "I'm 300 pounds overweight, but I did lose 50! You should be satisfied!" No, the problem is still there. I'm not saying you shouldn't congratulate the person or feel comforted by the improvement, but it definitely doesn't mean you should become compliant.
QUOTE (Sojiro @ Aug 13 2010, 09:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I didn't say approval, I said feedback.
Example:
-Admin posts a draft of the skills list for Illumination or at least general ideas
-Random player points out the lack of an entcall skill
-Admin can check it out and add it before it goes in, saving players months of hassle
Example 2:
-Admin posts about the demigod system along with potential essence costs
-Players point out that some costs are way too high
-Admins take this into consideration and can act on it, saving ragequit kneejerk comments all around.
Example:
-Admin posts a draft of the skills list for Illumination or at least general ideas
-Random player points out the lack of an entcall skill
-Admin can check it out and add it before it goes in, saving players months of hassle
Example 2:
-Admin posts about the demigod system along with potential essence costs
-Players point out that some costs are way too high
-Admins take this into consideration and can act on it, saving ragequit kneejerk comments all around.
Well said.
Eventru2010-08-14 02:50:07
QUOTE (Sojiro @ Aug 13 2010, 09:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I didn't say approval, I said feedback.
Example:
-Admin posts a draft of the skills list for Illumination or at least general ideas
-Random player points out the lack of an entcall skill
-Admin can check it out and add it before it goes in, saving players months of hassle
Example 2:
-Admin posts about the demigod system along with potential essence costs
-Players point out that some costs are way too high
-Admins take this into consideration and can act on it, saving ragequit kneejerk comments all around.
Example:
-Admin posts a draft of the skills list for Illumination or at least general ideas
-Random player points out the lack of an entcall skill
-Admin can check it out and add it before it goes in, saving players months of hassle
Example 2:
-Admin posts about the demigod system along with potential essence costs
-Players point out that some costs are way too high
-Admins take this into consideration and can act on it, saving ragequit kneejerk comments all around.
I've little faith such a situation would really work. First, it kills off whatever 'surprise' or 'mystique' or what have you releasing a skillset/feature has. In example, I doubt the would-be Illuminati would have been happy that (x group of not-them players) got to see their skills before they did, at their release. Secondly, it was player envoys would gave us the standard of 1 million essence an hour being standard for a good aetherhunting trip - with some players bragging numbers as high as 1.4-1.7m per hour. I'd expect 'more of the same', so to speak, from an 'advisory board'.
Unknown2010-08-14 02:59:53
QUOTE (Eventru @ Aug 13 2010, 10:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I've little faith such a situation would really work. First, it kills off whatever 'surprise' or 'mystique' or what have you releasing a skillset/feature has. In example, I doubt the would-be Illuminati would have been happy that (x group of not-them players) got to see their skills before they did, at their release. Secondly, it was player envoys would gave us the standard of 1 million essence an hour being standard for a good aetherhunting trip - with some players bragging numbers as high as 1.4-1.7m per hour.
I think it's a sad thing that "surprise" is valued more than "being tolerable," and that "we're unhappy because they got to see it first" is a worse situation than "we're unhappy because things are obviously lacking."
I'm a fairly active envoy, and, in the past three months, I was not asked and did not see anyone asked about essence rates (I was gone for a week, granted).
Unknown2010-08-14 03:05:40
I actually agree, my frustrations with the envoy system make it tough for me to trust the opinions of fellow players, so that's why I think player-nominated committees wouldn't work either.
Personally, I'd rather the admin just be allowed to 'play' lusternia again as mortals for a bit just to get back in touch with their proverbial roots, so to speak. That way, they get an idea of how exactly things are when you aren't viewing it from up above.
That's rather extreme, but otherwise, I'd rather the admin appoint players themselves, instead of other players nominating their peers. The last time the admin appointed a player to oversee a change themselves, forging got overhauled and made awesome
Personally, I'd rather the admin just be allowed to 'play' lusternia again as mortals for a bit just to get back in touch with their proverbial roots, so to speak. That way, they get an idea of how exactly things are when you aren't viewing it from up above.
That's rather extreme, but otherwise, I'd rather the admin appoint players themselves, instead of other players nominating their peers. The last time the admin appointed a player to oversee a change themselves, forging got overhauled and made awesome
Xenthos2010-08-14 03:41:22
QUOTE (Eventru @ Aug 13 2010, 10:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I've little faith such a situation would really work. First, it kills off whatever 'surprise' or 'mystique' or what have you releasing a skillset/feature has. In example, I doubt the would-be Illuminati would have been happy that (x group of not-them players) got to see their skills before they did, at their release. Secondly, it was player envoys would gave us the standard of 1 million essence an hour being standard for a good aetherhunting trip - with some players bragging numbers as high as 1.4-1.7m per hour. I'd expect 'more of the same', so to speak, from an 'advisory board'.
Keep in mind that you kept asking us "What is the absolute maximum essence gain you can get ever if everything is going in your favour except double XP days," so yes, you were given that number.
Every time we gave you those numbers we stated that trying to balance based on that was not a great idea, though.
Edit: Essentially, if you ask for outliers you get outliers. We also told you essence gain not via aetherships (350k an hour or so) for solo hunting. Astral bashing depends on the number of people in the group, so it varies between the two. And we also told you that that was a high total for aetherbashing with everything going perfectly (so not 'standard').
Sylphas2010-08-14 04:10:17
Would like to reiterate that there is a massive difference between "This is how it is, too bad" and "This is how it is, I'm sorry for the inconvenience/whatever, but here is what we can think of doing to maybe ameliorate the blow. If not, we at least are sorry for the pain it has caused."
Even when we know you mean the latter, it's nice to hear, instead "Closing the thread, sorry!"
Even when we know you mean the latter, it's nice to hear, instead "Closing the thread, sorry!"
