Like I said, my main hangup is this is designed for warriors whereas the other specs (aside from Tracking) are not. Heavily artifacted warriors aren't really underpowered against robe classes as-is, so possible specializations that are added in need to (on the whole) provide relatively minor benefits (mostly utility with a couple of skills that are good Warrior moves at most) for balance reasons. Tracking actually tries to follow this pattern too.

I also look at razorwind combined with burst vessels. Especially with no power cost, so it will exponentially stack with itself. Owch!

Edit: First cast, they're bleeding 500 from a couple of vessels. Now they're bleeding 1800. They spam clot it and are now low / out of mana. Next vessel tick, you cast it again and they're bleeding 1800. Cast it again and they're bleeding 4000. Etc.

these two descriptions need to go still. Warriors are not mages, they will never even come close to the mastery that mages have over their element and the implication that they might is wrong.

the *plate and *blade skill. Are these org specific or do the warriors get to choose?

As i've said, the issue I have is more thematic than anything. Ripple, Shatter, RazorWind, ChilledHeart, Sear (to some extent), Quicksand, IcicleRain, GreaterShatter they come off as something a mage would do. (i.e pretty much everything)

Ripple you could be something along the lines of... you strike the ground with your weapon causing the earth to crack slightly in a line towards the enemy that knocks them out of stance. (kinda like what happens here at 1:10 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b3-DZZU-T4) As a bonus it would demonstrate how far you are from actual mages.

RazorWind could have the warrior invoke the swiftness of air and then deliver a flurry of blows, though it might not work with bludgeoning weapons.

The rest are just soo magey that if the skill went in with them intact I would never be able to respect the characters who learned it. I would constantly be thinking things like... "oh you wanted to play mage but didn't like demesnes, aah kay" and the moment that one tried to claim that their elemental skill was equal to a mage I would being to verbalise those thoughts.

@Xenthos: Yea, I knew about Tracking, but I wanted to make the knight a mage-warrior hybrid, not a heavily-enchanted-warrior. Regarding the burstvessel business, I still don't see the big deal. Warriors can't give burstvessels, and there has never been a conclusion reached regarding whether or not we should balance around groups. Still, like I said, the skillset could serve to be Officially Balanced. FLAVOURMAN STRIKES AGAIN.

@Saran: I disagree with just about everything stated. See: Ecology for Bards, abilities like Crucify and Choke for warriors. Thematically? About as much sense as anything suggested. And yea, the multi-element abilities would be decided by your nexus. Always a fan of such abilities.

Maybe we could just have a Warrior mage class, or a gunner class?

I think imbalance is the key to any MMO, but we should wait until classes are balanced (or closer than they are) before throwing in more imbalance (which a new class would invariably lead to).

You see, the thing is... none of the abilities you just stated are a/in PRIMARY spec. You're asking for the primary skill of a class and you seem to feel that you should litter statements like "we're just as awesome elementalist as actual mages" it's like giving warriors (nature/cosmic/music) with their own spec and claiming that their power over the (natural world/cosmic planes/music) rivals (wiccans/druids/guardians/bards).

Ecology is rather debatable, it's more along the lines of natural lore which fits in with the commune bard concept. Illusions is actually more out there, but it is performance magic in the end.

Your statement would also hold weight if Crucify or Choke were in skill specs devoted to warriors, they are not, if this were the same as crow/necromancy/etc then warriors would be getting aeromancy/geomancy/etc and no one wants that.

Stepping back, consider how this skill would have come about. The org base skills that warriors get were all developed by other guilds and were later taught to the warrior guilds(as far as I know). If this skill was developed from the ground up to be used by warriors then it should reflect this more in theme, sure you use wounding but that is a mechanic, but this skill should scream warrior with elemental power not mage wannabe.

I haven't even gone into the... visible powerlevel of the abilities. Not what they actually do, but how powerful the look. Impaling someone with ice? seems like it would require a heavy connection to the water plane but then a few skills later you create quicksand and cause the ground to rise up and crush people implying a strong connection to earth which would lead to cries of "TAINTED!!!" in Celest

*blade, mageknight (if you change the description, from memory it's stated in the learn messages that true mastery can only come from dedicated study of a single element), shimmer, swiftstrike, *plate, magewarrior, fireheart, stormsurge, stonefeet. These work towards a really cool image in my mind. The warrior is taking the elemental powers and using them to augment their own abilities, it is a warrior being a warrior with elemental powers but the rest of the abilities don't support this image.

Again, the version of the class I had in mind was mages who were also warriors. An actual master of two disciplines. Still, thought about what you said, and removed some of the more 'wowmagic' abilities in favour of new (I like to think better) ideas I had.

I bump this, just because this idea was insanely cool.

So your idea was a class that was just better then everybody else, RP wise?

If you consider mages/warriors as masters of only single disciplines each, sure.