Yeah - either you say nothing and some poor schmuck gets bandwagon lynched for not posting enough/poor choice of words, or you retread old ground ad nauseam until everyone else suffers a psychotic break and lynches you out of spite rather than suspicion. (We call this Pulling A Daganev.)

Ah, Day One, how we love thee. It's like Lord of the Flies.

Meh. Wish the discussion of 'win' conditions hadn't drawn out so long. I suspect certain people may have intentionally guided it in circles, 1) because it's a neutral topic that they can discuss without siding themselves on a particular side, and 2) the long it goes on, the longer impatience mounts, propelling everyone to just a random lynch or no lynch. Given the odds, with either outcome the death eaters serve to gain something.

Hmm. Hmm.

I'm not really sure what we -should- be discussing at this stage. Is there a possibility someone learned something last night? If so, would it be worth the possible risk to disclose it? Is there any reason a random lynch, or no lynch, would be worse than any sort of deadline the mod might give?

Unless we have another cop who struck scum on the first night, then no.

And really, we have plenty to discuss already beyond the victory conditions. I've said quite a lot about Vendetta already, but how people seem to ignore that Vendetta claimed to be a student that is part of the Ministry of Magic is astonishing. Am I the only one who got severe "falseclaim" alerts?

I doubt we should assume that all those that win with the Ministry are employed by the Ministry. Otherwise there would be no students at all in the game, and since we already know that Harry is, I'd think it's safe to assume that other roles are occupied by more or less prominent students as well. I'm fairly certain that all those that normally would win with Town (vanilla, various minor roles) instead win with the Ministry.

That being said, though, it does strike me as rather odd to make a vanilla roleclaim this early in the game, and especially one that's that obscure in the books.

Yeah, vanilla roleclaiming is weird, especially with the whole secret extra bit. On the other hand, Ernie in the source material goes on to be a fairly badass member of the DA, so if the roleclaim is correct there's probably nothing to worry about.

There are also probably other students, and I'd be willing to bet teachers, too. What'd Hogwarts be without students and teachers, after all? Oh, and supernatural threats upon everyone's peace and safety.

But Harry is already part of the Order, which means he may not be a part of the Ministry. And there are tons other students I would use before Macmillian in this game. Ronny, Ginny, Hermione, Luna, Neville, Lavender, Parvatti, Cho. The list goes on. I don't believe Vendetta for a second.

Well, we can do a simple test to see if it is out of place. So long as some are willing, any other students who win with the Ministry? I don't care for names or powers, just that much will do to see if Vendetta makes sense.

We don't know that Harry is part of the Order. Personally I suspect he is (it would make more sense than him being with the Ministry), but we don't know. And yeah, there's plenty of obscure people in the books, making a false vanilla roleclaim somewhat easy. That's my main concern about Vendetta. Then again, it could still be a valid roleclaim...

Are you really suggesting that Harry Potter would be a part of the MoM before he is a part of the Order?

Do try to read what I wrote. I also believe that Harry is part of the Order, but we don't know for sure.

I don't think that's what's being said at all. The post that lists win conditions clearly states that there are people who aren't with either.

I very much doubt that's the case with Harry though, since the Ministry win condition says "all those that don't win with the Ministry or Order must be dead" (or some such, written directly from memory). If Harry wasn't with either the Ministry or the Order, it means he'd have to die for the Ministry win condition, which sounds very weird.

I am reading what you're writing, and I find it a poor attempt to deflect suspicion. There is no reason whatsoever why any student should win with the Ministry of Magic.

There are 15 around. 4 are Deatheaters, so that gives 11 "town" to work with. We know that 2 are Harry and Fudge. 9 left. Since there is someone with an unique win condition, we know him to be outside the groups we usually consider. 8 left. The Order must be a group. Otherwise they wouldn't autolose when Harry Potter die. At least one more there. 7 left. 7 people to distribute on more Order members, students, teachers and Ministers. Even assuming an overwhelming amount of students, you would still see Ronny, Hermione, Luna, Neville and Ginny before other students. 2 left to share on teachers, more order members and actual ministry members.

You know I wouldn't be so angry if it wasn't for people going on about "Oh, this is day one, we can't do nothing" when people have been served such a seven course, five star meal of scumminess.

Yes, I agree with your math, and I've always said that Vendettas roleclaim was suspicious. All I've said is that it might be a valid roleclaim, and that it's not enough for me to vote.

That win condition is... way off. It almost sounds like you're trying to split up town. FOS: Ssaliss.

What does FOS mean?

Uh...

That's exactly what I wrote, isn't it?