Gleip2010-11-28 13:15:29
QUOTE (casilu @ Nov 27 2010, 03:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Trueheal and awesome regen are pretty nice.
Trueheal requires an unlocked channel though. Which is sad. Not to object though. Psymet is awesome for tanking. Iron skin, bloodboil and bonedensity are great. And tossing Regeneration on top of Lobo and Harmony and Mercy regen is just... droolable.
Unknown2010-11-28 17:57:54
Don't forget the ability to add power on demand.
Gleip2010-11-28 18:44:29
At the cost of one momentum yeah. It takes at least 5 seconds to use Bodyfuel, which still drains 1000 health from you, and considering that you use power mainly for boosts, and some of the better abilities, regeneration and bonedensity, are on Super and Id channels.
And you can't use bodyfuel to power up SuspendedAnimation either and still use Psymet effectively, because bodyfuel is on ID, and Suspend is on Super.
Bodyfuel really isn't something to write home about.
And you can't use bodyfuel to power up SuspendedAnimation either and still use Psymet effectively, because bodyfuel is on ID, and Suspend is on Super.
Bodyfuel really isn't something to write home about.
Unknown2010-11-29 04:45:09
QUOTE (Gleip @ Nov 28 2010, 01:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
At the cost of one momentum yeah. It takes at least 5 seconds to use Bodyfuel, which still drains 1000 health from you, and considering that you use power mainly for boosts, and some of the better abilities, regeneration and bonedensity, are on Super and Id channels.
And you can't use bodyfuel to power up SuspendedAnimation either and still use Psymet effectively, because bodyfuel is on ID, and Suspend is on Super.
Bodyfuel really isn't something to write home about.
And you can't use bodyfuel to power up SuspendedAnimation either and still use Psymet effectively, because bodyfuel is on ID, and Suspend is on Super.
Bodyfuel really isn't something to write home about.
It is with other trans skills. It's similar to deepcover. It's extremely powerful, but one has to know when to use it.
Unknown2010-11-29 04:49:50
QUOTE (Sahmiam Mes'ard @ Nov 28 2010, 10:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It is with other trans skills. It's similar to deepcover. It's extremely powerful, but one has to know when to use it.
Bodyfuel means unlimited Great Pent. Just ask Thul.
Sylphas2010-11-29 04:58:55
QUOTE (Gleip @ Nov 28 2010, 01:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
At the cost of one momentum yeah. It takes at least 5 seconds to use Bodyfuel, which still drains 1000 health from you, and considering that you use power mainly for boosts, and some of the better abilities, regeneration and bonedensity, are on Super and Id channels.
And you can't use bodyfuel to power up SuspendedAnimation either and still use Psymet effectively, because bodyfuel is on ID, and Suspend is on Super.
Bodyfuel really isn't something to write home about.
And you can't use bodyfuel to power up SuspendedAnimation either and still use Psymet effectively, because bodyfuel is on ID, and Suspend is on Super.
Bodyfuel really isn't something to write home about.
Outside of combat, it makes Teleport and other skills basically power-free.
Lerad2010-12-05 05:44:03
I'm bored, so I wrote an essay:
On the topic of Acrobatics vs Psymet, Acrobatics is generally superior to Psymet in most general areas except for a couple of niche ones. It has great passive effects that would be great for anyone, not just monks. Hyperactive is the icing on the cake. It lasts only a short time for 10 power, but that's more than enough to completely overwhelm one person if you pull the right moves, and in a team fight where you aren't getting hit, it's even more devastating. Psymet has more abilities that cater to monk strategies, though, like bodyfuel, doublepain etc. Both psymet and acrobatics have roughly equal stat buffs and dmp (psymet slightly more for bashing, and acrobatics slightly more for pvp), so what it boils down to is contort+somersault+jumpkick vs doublepain+bloodboil.
On the topic of specific monk specs, I feel that Nekotai have the most coherent strategies amongst all four specs. Nekotai (emo) monks have a wide variety of finishers. Damage is a given, all monk specs are capable of pumping out obscene damage under the right conditions. Nekotai have the additional benefit of obscene bleeding. Arguably, they can build vessels faster than a TK, depending on the luck of the roll, and they have two bleeding kicks (one that gives haemophilia, the other that gives bleeding based off wounds). Their vessel building is also based off kicks. Kicks also ignore rebounding. They are probably the premier bleeding class in the game, and this meshes very well with other guilds in Glomdoring, with added bleeding, doubled mana use (did this get changed?) for clotting, mana kill etc. Nekotai also have the most reliable greenlock in the game, since they have the highest rate of poison transfer due to a specific ability as well as an additional poison transfer attempt outside of weapons. Of course, it is also the costliest greenlock amongst the monk guilds, taking 8 power and zapping their momentum to half. On the flip side, it's relatively easy to get out of a greenlock unless the Nekotai took the time to overload you with afflictions for a chance to have the cure hit the wrong afflictions. Nevertheless, still a very potent strategy. Nekotai are also generally good at stacking afflictions, again with the highest poison transfer rate and more poison attempts, and a natural marjoram stack in their basic attack that can be used to stack into the higher momentum forms easily. With a good mixup of proning/hindering moves, you can find yourself with alot of afflictions very quickly. Nekotai also have good regeneration salve afflictions, and an endurance draining move as well. The only downside is that their instakill is slightly lackluster. A 10 second poison instantkill during which the user can still attack is undeniably powerful, but compared to all their other options (and the ease with which you can get out of a greenlock and thus neuter the instakill) it just doesn't compare favourably.
/End nekotai-plug
Shofangi has the best endurance drain out of all the monk guilds. Probably. Crushed chest can drain endurance to critical levels in a handful of seconds, and Shofangi can stack salve balance very well, though they don't really have good herb stacking. They also get an easy way to bypass parry and stancing, though pulling off the move to do so will have to contend with parry and stancing in the first place, but that's not usually a problem. They have a less reliable but cheaper greenlock, which they used to be able to do over and over ad infinitum, meaning they could simply try it again after a short break even if they fail on poison transfer until they get it. Well, they can still do it repeatedly, but there's a longer window between the greenlock attempts now, which gives the victim a larger window to haul ass or hinder. They can do bleeding, as stated already, but it doesn't really compare to the Nekotai version. Their insta used to be pretty much useless, partly because there's no point if you could (still can?) greenlock-lock, and also partly because the insta was very hard to pull off. A grapple-ender based on wounds with a chance to fail, iirc. It's been changed recently, but I don't know exactly how viable it is now.
Ninjakari is probably the most grapple-dependant of the monk classes. Most of their dangerous afflictions come via grapple-enders. It is already hard enough against contortionists (though they have ways around it) but it basically means you can predict and pre-restore if you're smart. Of course, that could backfire as well. Like the Nekotai, they have good synergy with allied orgs, balance-slowing, keeping targets in the room, yanking targets from out of room etc. They also have good proning and stunning moves, but suffer with a much harder greenlock (due to grapple requirement). They also have bleeding, but much like the Shofangi, good but not spectacular. They are great at building wounds though, with their balance-slowing afflictions sharing a cure with wound-curing. While monks don't use wounds for their afflictions, high wounding is one of the requirements for reaching the upper limit of damage. The longer you stay in a room fighting a ninja, the slower you get and the harder he hits. A solid strategy if there ever was one. Their insta is pretty devastating, being a regeneration based timed insta, there is only a short window for the victim to apply before he is killed. With the proper setup and well-placed stuns and poisons, you can pretty much guarantee a kill. Definitely viable in 1v1, very much so in a team, though it's possibly faster to just damage-kill.
Tahtetso are a mixed bag. They have a harder greenlock than ninjas, because of grapple-ending requirements. They stack salves with more ease than shofangi, and can prone very easily. They have great hindering, and an awesome insta. That's about all I know, though, having fought them very little outside of the arena. What little experience I've had in the arena mostly consisted of double hemiplegy until they have enough momentum to prone and regen-lock into their insta. Which is pretty amazing, really. They probably have the best insta amongst all the monk guilds, requiring prone and an additional, unique affliction. Proning is not a problem, with their many ways to stack both mending and regeneration afflictions to prevent standing as well as a wide array of proning moves. It boils down to getting balance back before they cure the other unique affliction... which isn't too difficult since it is a regeneration cure.
The last things to consider amongst monk guilds is the secondary, harmony vs stealth. Stealth is probably superior in most ways, with a wide variety of utility abilities in addition to some very nifty combat based moves. Harmony, however, can be used to very good effect in combat. It shines the most in defensive applications. One of the worst combinations a monk can face is a harmony/acrobatic monk. Between dodging and peaced-on-strike, as well as the normal stancing/parry/rebounding, it can easily frustrate monks and one-handers. That's less effective against casters, but harmony is also extremely versatile in application. Stealth on the other hand, gives a very powerful edge to the commune/city of the monk in both revolts, village rivalry, etc. The ability to move through enemy guards is unique to stealth users, except for maybe divine fire. Stealth also offers alot of out-of-room shenanigans. Harmony is probably best paired with acrobatics, and stealth with psymet. Acrobatics can provide the out-of-room attacks that harmony lacks and stealth has, and psymet gives stealth users the passive boosts that stealth lacks. Of course, you could go the other way around and make a harmony monk an in-room tank-monster, or make a stealth monk near impossible to pin down, but that's up to you.
On the topic of Acrobatics vs Psymet, Acrobatics is generally superior to Psymet in most general areas except for a couple of niche ones. It has great passive effects that would be great for anyone, not just monks. Hyperactive is the icing on the cake. It lasts only a short time for 10 power, but that's more than enough to completely overwhelm one person if you pull the right moves, and in a team fight where you aren't getting hit, it's even more devastating. Psymet has more abilities that cater to monk strategies, though, like bodyfuel, doublepain etc. Both psymet and acrobatics have roughly equal stat buffs and dmp (psymet slightly more for bashing, and acrobatics slightly more for pvp), so what it boils down to is contort+somersault+jumpkick vs doublepain+bloodboil.
On the topic of specific monk specs, I feel that Nekotai have the most coherent strategies amongst all four specs. Nekotai (emo) monks have a wide variety of finishers. Damage is a given, all monk specs are capable of pumping out obscene damage under the right conditions. Nekotai have the additional benefit of obscene bleeding. Arguably, they can build vessels faster than a TK, depending on the luck of the roll, and they have two bleeding kicks (one that gives haemophilia, the other that gives bleeding based off wounds). Their vessel building is also based off kicks. Kicks also ignore rebounding. They are probably the premier bleeding class in the game, and this meshes very well with other guilds in Glomdoring, with added bleeding, doubled mana use (did this get changed?) for clotting, mana kill etc. Nekotai also have the most reliable greenlock in the game, since they have the highest rate of poison transfer due to a specific ability as well as an additional poison transfer attempt outside of weapons. Of course, it is also the costliest greenlock amongst the monk guilds, taking 8 power and zapping their momentum to half. On the flip side, it's relatively easy to get out of a greenlock unless the Nekotai took the time to overload you with afflictions for a chance to have the cure hit the wrong afflictions. Nevertheless, still a very potent strategy. Nekotai are also generally good at stacking afflictions, again with the highest poison transfer rate and more poison attempts, and a natural marjoram stack in their basic attack that can be used to stack into the higher momentum forms easily. With a good mixup of proning/hindering moves, you can find yourself with alot of afflictions very quickly. Nekotai also have good regeneration salve afflictions, and an endurance draining move as well. The only downside is that their instakill is slightly lackluster. A 10 second poison instantkill during which the user can still attack is undeniably powerful, but compared to all their other options (and the ease with which you can get out of a greenlock and thus neuter the instakill) it just doesn't compare favourably.
/End nekotai-plug
Shofangi has the best endurance drain out of all the monk guilds. Probably. Crushed chest can drain endurance to critical levels in a handful of seconds, and Shofangi can stack salve balance very well, though they don't really have good herb stacking. They also get an easy way to bypass parry and stancing, though pulling off the move to do so will have to contend with parry and stancing in the first place, but that's not usually a problem. They have a less reliable but cheaper greenlock, which they used to be able to do over and over ad infinitum, meaning they could simply try it again after a short break even if they fail on poison transfer until they get it. Well, they can still do it repeatedly, but there's a longer window between the greenlock attempts now, which gives the victim a larger window to haul ass or hinder. They can do bleeding, as stated already, but it doesn't really compare to the Nekotai version. Their insta used to be pretty much useless, partly because there's no point if you could (still can?) greenlock-lock, and also partly because the insta was very hard to pull off. A grapple-ender based on wounds with a chance to fail, iirc. It's been changed recently, but I don't know exactly how viable it is now.
Ninjakari is probably the most grapple-dependant of the monk classes. Most of their dangerous afflictions come via grapple-enders. It is already hard enough against contortionists (though they have ways around it) but it basically means you can predict and pre-restore if you're smart. Of course, that could backfire as well. Like the Nekotai, they have good synergy with allied orgs, balance-slowing, keeping targets in the room, yanking targets from out of room etc. They also have good proning and stunning moves, but suffer with a much harder greenlock (due to grapple requirement). They also have bleeding, but much like the Shofangi, good but not spectacular. They are great at building wounds though, with their balance-slowing afflictions sharing a cure with wound-curing. While monks don't use wounds for their afflictions, high wounding is one of the requirements for reaching the upper limit of damage. The longer you stay in a room fighting a ninja, the slower you get and the harder he hits. A solid strategy if there ever was one. Their insta is pretty devastating, being a regeneration based timed insta, there is only a short window for the victim to apply before he is killed. With the proper setup and well-placed stuns and poisons, you can pretty much guarantee a kill. Definitely viable in 1v1, very much so in a team, though it's possibly faster to just damage-kill.
Tahtetso are a mixed bag. They have a harder greenlock than ninjas, because of grapple-ending requirements. They stack salves with more ease than shofangi, and can prone very easily. They have great hindering, and an awesome insta. That's about all I know, though, having fought them very little outside of the arena. What little experience I've had in the arena mostly consisted of double hemiplegy until they have enough momentum to prone and regen-lock into their insta. Which is pretty amazing, really. They probably have the best insta amongst all the monk guilds, requiring prone and an additional, unique affliction. Proning is not a problem, with their many ways to stack both mending and regeneration afflictions to prevent standing as well as a wide array of proning moves. It boils down to getting balance back before they cure the other unique affliction... which isn't too difficult since it is a regeneration cure.
The last things to consider amongst monk guilds is the secondary, harmony vs stealth. Stealth is probably superior in most ways, with a wide variety of utility abilities in addition to some very nifty combat based moves. Harmony, however, can be used to very good effect in combat. It shines the most in defensive applications. One of the worst combinations a monk can face is a harmony/acrobatic monk. Between dodging and peaced-on-strike, as well as the normal stancing/parry/rebounding, it can easily frustrate monks and one-handers. That's less effective against casters, but harmony is also extremely versatile in application. Stealth on the other hand, gives a very powerful edge to the commune/city of the monk in both revolts, village rivalry, etc. The ability to move through enemy guards is unique to stealth users, except for maybe divine fire. Stealth also offers alot of out-of-room shenanigans. Harmony is probably best paired with acrobatics, and stealth with psymet. Acrobatics can provide the out-of-room attacks that harmony lacks and stealth has, and psymet gives stealth users the passive boosts that stealth lacks. Of course, you could go the other way around and make a harmony monk an in-room tank-monster, or make a stealth monk near impossible to pin down, but that's up to you.
Ircria2010-12-05 06:06:06
Lovely essay, Lerad. It captures it well. Psymet does have more uses than that(enhancement works very well), but we can leave that be.
Two things here. Psymet with harmony can be very useful, especially with certain races(Loboshigaru, who with harmony regeneration, kingdom, psymet regeneration, and racial regen, can reach a natural regen rate of over 1100 HP every few seconds). Also, the Shofangi insta is viable. The high wounding it causes does provide for more damage to the head, plus the fact that in the same form as the grapple, we are able to apply blackout, which will hide the blackout line preventing any writhing or contorting.
EDIT: >.> Of course, it is still seven grapples and enders, so it's not the best. But, it still works, and is uncurable.
QUOTE (Lerad @ Dec 4 2010, 09:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Shofangi has the best endurance drain out of all the monk guilds. Probably. Crushed chest can drain endurance to critical levels in a handful of seconds, and Shofangi can stack salve balance very well, though they don't really have good herb stacking. They also get an easy way to bypass parry and stancing, though pulling off the move to do so will have to contend with parry and stancing in the first place, but that's not usually a problem. They have a less reliable but cheaper greenlock, which they used to be able to do over and over ad infinitum, meaning they could simply try it again after a short break even if they fail on poison transfer until they get it. Well, they can still do it repeatedly, but there's a longer window between the greenlock attempts now, which gives the victim a larger window to haul ass or hinder. They can do bleeding, as stated already, but it doesn't really compare to the Nekotai version. Their insta used to be pretty much useless, partly because there's no point if you could (still can?) greenlock-lock, and also partly because the insta was very hard to pull off. A grapple-ender based on wounds with a chance to fail, iirc. It's been changed recently, but I don't know exactly how viable it is now.
The last things to consider amongst monk guilds is the secondary, harmony vs stealth. Stealth is probably superior in most ways, with a wide variety of utility abilities in addition to some very nifty combat based moves. Harmony, however, can be used to very good effect in combat. It shines the most in defensive applications. One of the worst combinations a monk can face is a harmony/acrobatic monk. Between dodging and peaced-on-strike, as well as the normal stancing/parry/rebounding, it can easily frustrate monks and one-handers. That's less effective against casters, but harmony is also extremely versatile in application. Stealth on the other hand, gives a very powerful edge to the commune/city of the monk in both revolts, village rivalry, etc. The ability to move through enemy guards is unique to stealth users, except for maybe divine fire. Stealth also offers alot of out-of-room shenanigans. Harmony is probably best paired with acrobatics, and stealth with psymet. Acrobatics can provide the out-of-room attacks that harmony lacks and stealth has, and psymet gives stealth users the passive boosts that stealth lacks. Of course, you could go the other way around and make a harmony monk an in-room tank-monster, or make a stealth monk near impossible to pin down, but that's up to you.
The last things to consider amongst monk guilds is the secondary, harmony vs stealth. Stealth is probably superior in most ways, with a wide variety of utility abilities in addition to some very nifty combat based moves. Harmony, however, can be used to very good effect in combat. It shines the most in defensive applications. One of the worst combinations a monk can face is a harmony/acrobatic monk. Between dodging and peaced-on-strike, as well as the normal stancing/parry/rebounding, it can easily frustrate monks and one-handers. That's less effective against casters, but harmony is also extremely versatile in application. Stealth on the other hand, gives a very powerful edge to the commune/city of the monk in both revolts, village rivalry, etc. The ability to move through enemy guards is unique to stealth users, except for maybe divine fire. Stealth also offers alot of out-of-room shenanigans. Harmony is probably best paired with acrobatics, and stealth with psymet. Acrobatics can provide the out-of-room attacks that harmony lacks and stealth has, and psymet gives stealth users the passive boosts that stealth lacks. Of course, you could go the other way around and make a harmony monk an in-room tank-monster, or make a stealth monk near impossible to pin down, but that's up to you.
Two things here. Psymet with harmony can be very useful, especially with certain races(Loboshigaru, who with harmony regeneration, kingdom, psymet regeneration, and racial regen, can reach a natural regen rate of over 1100 HP every few seconds). Also, the Shofangi insta is viable. The high wounding it causes does provide for more damage to the head, plus the fact that in the same form as the grapple, we are able to apply blackout, which will hide the blackout line preventing any writhing or contorting.
EDIT: >.> Of course, it is still seven grapples and enders, so it's not the best. But, it still works, and is uncurable.
Janalon2010-12-05 06:30:26
This analysis should be framed and hung on a wall somewhere for later reference. Seriously! I would like to see a more in-depth analysis of the benefits of the psionics/psymet skill set though... Otherwise dead on the money.
On a side note... psymet doublepain is helpful as much as it is an impedance. Against a Nekoati, it is very easy to "bleed out" ego in a few hits (as a near demi, loboshigaru). This carries the burnout drawbacks: losing exp, unlocking all of the psionic channels, and preventing any psionic use for a long while. This drawback even carries through QQ'ing, so you are left without defenses throughout gameplay.
Illithoid ego (through ill drain) gives psymet monks an amazing ego buffer... far superior to any other race for this purpose. I suppose that is slotted to be adjusted with racial changes.
On a side note... psymet doublepain is helpful as much as it is an impedance. Against a Nekoati, it is very easy to "bleed out" ego in a few hits (as a near demi, loboshigaru). This carries the burnout drawbacks: losing exp, unlocking all of the psionic channels, and preventing any psionic use for a long while. This drawback even carries through QQ'ing, so you are left without defenses throughout gameplay.
Illithoid ego (through ill drain) gives psymet monks an amazing ego buffer... far superior to any other race for this purpose. I suppose that is slotted to be adjusted with racial changes.
Faymar2010-12-05 09:36:07
QUOTE (Lerad @ Dec 5 2010, 07:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
...
They probably have the best insta amongst all the monk guilds, requiring prone and an additional, unique affliction. Proning is not a problem, with their many ways to stack both mending and regeneration afflictions to prevent standing as well as a wide array of proning moves. It boils down to getting balance back before they cure the other unique affliction... which isn't too difficult since it is a regeneration cure.
...
They probably have the best insta amongst all the monk guilds, requiring prone and an additional, unique affliction. Proning is not a problem, with their many ways to stack both mending and regeneration afflictions to prevent standing as well as a wide array of proning moves. It boils down to getting balance back before they cure the other unique affliction... which isn't too difficult since it is a regeneration cure.
...
I would like to point out that both the unique affliction (chest pain) and the shattered ankle I've seen tahtetso use to keep you prone are curable with allheale or with a powercure (and any similar abilities). Against someone who cures well it's harder to pull off than you think.
Unknown2010-12-05 18:16:10
Only mistake I saw was that it's Tahtetso that have the grapple-ender greenlock, not Ninjakari. Ninjakari have windpipe + 2 poison procs.