STAB THEM IN THEIR BACK. DESTROY DESTROY DESTROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOY.

I can't do anything to the Great Houses until my progeny start popping out more babies.

And as for plays? The help files say directing and performing in plays is worth honor, but that's another situation where actually only the prestige winner gets honor. Unfortunately, plays don't have the same critique system as books, so I imagine that's why every successful recording doesn't instantly grant honor to the performers and directors.

Why are we still working with a "race to the cap" system? Why not a rolling average of the last X years honor gains? If you start slacking, you slip back down, if someone is bringing in tons more honor than you, they get most honourable. It makes no sense to revamp the whole system and have the outcome be "This family is locked in unless they do really dumb things or all go inactive."

So, Eventru mentioned over Envoys that A] he was looking to add costs for blood house members getting killed, people loosing elections (not resigning) and possibly a few other things and B] he is also accepting suggestions for honor gain/loss things. Someone mind rounding up all the good/popular ideas in the thread and posting them in a big long list?

people loosing elections (not resigning)

These are only random suggestions.

You don't lose defs in non-combat arena events. I meant things like slippers and freezetag for the noncoms.

Gains for claiming domoth crowns for their aligned city, major - Still disagree, domoths carry bonuses enough, and the process of claiming will already yield hunting and possibly pk honour for blood houses. This isn't about blood houses only; right now honour houses lose honour for killing people while claiming a domoth. This needs to be addressed. Either way, a small boost for claiming a crown doesn't seem to be a huge deal. It doesn't have to be an epic gain and the bonuses for many of the domoths are minor at crown level.

Gains for planting individual wildnodes, minor - maybe, but only cumulative like debating/influencing in revolts

Gains for winning wildnodes, major - this is an org effort not a family one, there's no clear way to attribute honour I see no reason each aligned greathouse couldn't receive a boost from this.

Gains for killing/converting a super-mob, major - again, a group effort, with one person getting a lucky shot - also transient enemy stuff, also not all smobs are equal, too many disagreeable things. No more 'lucky' that someone gaining honour for getting the final shot on a ship during an aether fight. Its a group effort, three gunners but only one gunner gets the bonus.


Gains for becoming a demigod, minor - this seems more like a personal achievement, which already carries a set of bonuses... getting there will already yield a ton of hunting/influencing bonuses, unless this is just a way to milk honour out of abashing, in which case, double no. This isn't a huge necessity but a tiny boost from gaining demigod is hardly a big deal imo.

Gains for becoming an vernal/true ascendant, major - on the fence with this one... it is a personal achievement but one where you need the support of your org -- I'm not sure if family politics wouldn't provide an additional barrier for these already incredibly limited spot. Also grumble grumble retroactive. Not sure about that but okay.

Gains for killing org enemies, outside of org territory, minor - sure

Gains for winning non-combat arena events, minor - maybe too easy to game? I don't think so.

Gains for winning world events (hamsterhunts, death matches), major - sure

Gains for winning a Seal, major - same thing with TA really, further it will only encourage the old guard to
continue claiming all the same seals repeatedly so long as they play - forgive me if I've mistaken you for someone else, but weren't you against that last time the discussion came up? If it was not you, it was definitely a concern expressed in general. Estarra made it pretty clear that it's fine for the same people to win Seals over and over and over and over and over again. It is what it is. Some honour gained from winning such a coveted prize is warranted.

Gains from completing normal quests, minor - it's been said before that it might be way too difficult to go through all the quests, but if implemented, it should be a one-shot deal that is also available to those who have completed the quest before (meaning they can do it once more for honour, but only once) Cool.

Gains for winning normal debates outside of village revolts against other greathouses, minor - no way, there's no loss for the loser, too easy to game. I actually mentioned that some loss occur if losing these debates.

Gains for winning battlerun events, minor (not sure if this is already implemented) - again, too easy to game. The only arena things that count for honour are ranked spars, which have a gain for the winner and a loss for the loser. I don't think FFAs can be gamed anymore than ranked spars. Winning a FFA/battlerun should gain honour since only one person can win those. It's not like a wargames, with odd teams. Not seeing a huge issue here. It seems your main concern is that there should be losses for those that lose...I'm all for losses. Blood Houses certainly need them.


Loss for having your domoth absolved, major - still not sold on this, but I guess so.

Loss for dying to mobs or players (this should be tied in particular to blood houses, who lose no honour presently), major - dying to mobs? That's a little harsh. Dying to mobs over and over is not harsh. It just means that person sucks at being a blood house member and needs to get in shape! I think it's quite fitting. It wouldn't be a loss each time they died but cumulative.

Loss for losing demigod, minor - Sounds griefy. Naaaaah.

Loss for losing debates inside and outside of village revolts, against other greathouses, minor - sure.

Loss for losing a revolt for a village with +3 feelings towards your org, major - again, how will you assign a particular family to claim responsibility here. Like with domoths, spread the gains to each aligned greathouse.

Loss for dying in an aether implosion, minor - not sure about this one, either. I am!

Loss for losing non-combat arena events, minor - losing defs AND honour? People will participate less than they do now. Not sure if you lose defs from those but they should definitely gain from winning them. I just wanted to include something extra for noncoms that doesn't have anything to do with books, influencing and plays.

Loss from being booted from a guild, major - sure

Is family race honour gain 25 per person? I'm trying to convince Barrin we should be elfen, because we have double the number of elfen to faelings. I need to work out rate of honour gains to make up for the loss from changing race.

right now honour houses lose honour for killing people while claiming a domoth.

No more 'lucky' that someone gaining honour for getting the final shot on a ship during an aether fight. Its a group effort, three gunners but only one gunner gets the bonus.

I don't think FFAs can be gamed anymore than ranked spars.