Aison, you need to keep in mind how easy / hard it is to get credits in those games. Achaea is still the biggest game, so there might be lots of supply. I've been told Aetolia has a much faster gold gain than us too. I personally suspect the credit prices to go down again soonish when this stupid alt promo ends (sorry admins ) and more supply comes in. Was also an auction lately, and tattoos being released.

My advice? Befriend a warrior or just any other archetype, cause everything bashes faster than guardians, and tag along with them. Offer puella chanting and your extra damage output in exchange for an even share. I feel your pain though, I invited -everyone- on Facebook and keep snatching each new friend for the credits. Am on top of digg voting and commenting too. And if there are credits / lessons upon login I will make sure to soak up every damn last one of those as well >_<

/derail

Personally, the biggest deterrent to do ANYTHING in the game other than stay in the city or manse is the ridiculous essence cost. I've stopped trying. I can bash kephera for hours and not gain enough essence to make up for one death there. When it takes hours of time to compensate for a few seconds of loss, that's a problem, and it's gotten to the point where I've been tempted to heartstop to titan to just kill any and all desire to log back in. Your disincentive to raid has turned into a disincentive to leave a manse as most things worth doing require one to enter enemy territory, even if it's to bash something that gives decent gold or xp.

I'd like to see the deaths in npc territory GREATLY lessened.

How can focus be abused, except for someone to protect an ally? If that ally is protected, however, they can't do anything aggressive to ANY other player. I also don't think it'd be too difficult to code unless the code is already a mess: a bolt and lock approach would work, imo.

Sad, but true. I hardly ever bash anymore, or influence, two of my favorite activities, because I simply can't afford the essence loss of doing so on my demigod. It's sad when the main reason for creating a new alt for me is just to get some good hunting/influencing in.

A symbol is the same strength/speed as staff for PvE, you just have lower dmp (though you can get things like putre and such) than mages. Celestines, however, are better bashers than Nihilists due to their extra attack.

Your version of bashing competence is based on what you hunt. In a group on astral for instance where I get 1-2 combos per mob I cant maintain mo so my bashing is pseudo crappy compared to the artied up powerhouses that are the mages/guardians with runes (even though I have runes too).

@Aison

If I get lucky, I can just mow through a specific set of mobs and get 20K gold in a little under 20 minutes. I already said before, after changes, that increased gold drops might be a little wonky. I don't really bother with the credit market since I don't need to, but if there's other people out there who can tank and crit even half as well as I do, I'm sure they're capable.

I'm not sure how readily available gold is in Achaea, but I have a sneaking suspicion that with the same relative advantages, I wouldn't rake in as much.

Problem is not everyone can do that, and some people do rely on the in-game credit market to trans skills and buy artifacts and such. 8k is a pretty crazy price, even if you're making 10k every 10 minutes, which, like you said, you can get lucky enough to do one day but not another because someone else might have influenced begging there or bashed it out already or you've got someone tailing your bum so you can't really bash anyway.

It's a huge turn off to see the high market prices and think, "Well I can go creditless, waste hours getting enough gold for a handful of credits, buy them oocly, or I can just leave and not worry about it."

So while each in-game economy is different, I think, considering how many gold sinks Lusternia possesses, the credit market shouldn't be one of them. I don't actively play any of the other IRE games, though

The credit market is entirely player controlled, for good or for ill.

I will note I'm hearing people are making 2.3m gold in a matter of 48 hours - and, after some poking at envoys, it seems wholly probably, with 40-50k an hour, influencing something anyone level 40+ can.

I'd be surprised if credit prices don't rise a bit more, personally.

Gold rewards, across the board, have gone up - I'm hearing as much as 250%. Don't be surprised if, similarly, credit prices rise roughly the same amount.

I think part of the problem is we've had so many major artifact releases lately that people want, but absolutely none of them are cheap. Things like the clangorum pliers and endowment...

Even notwithstanding that, gold sinks are kind of two-sided, since people with relatively little may feel the same temptation or desire to put gold into them as anyone else. Tradeskills have the same issue - undervaluing things makes it easier for novices to get the stuff they need, but it also means everyone else has more gold to spend and compete with them on the market with.

Mm, 5-7 min?

Gonna put vitae up before every raid now and escape to safety

If you die with vitae up in enemy territory, you now drop to level 23.

Re: Eventru's last post.

Short version -

Longer version (but still pretty short, work at 4am tomorrow and all.) :


When we have long running lopsided org situations like we do now, the last thing we need to do is make it easier for a winning org to mutilate a weak org. If anything, strong defensive advantages inspire weaker orgs to at least try to defend. And a cobbled together defense is almost going to always be far less coordinated, and far less fighter heavy, than a premeditated raid. It just goes to basic common sense.

Making it easier for a group to take over an opposing territory, and destroy anyone who comes to defend with (springtraps-pit|barrier|choke|pfifth|cruicify|Ability A) while tearing them to ribbons with (chasm|decapitate|deathsong|rapidmanakill|Ability just makes defenders want to do exactly what Eventru said. Log off. Because nobody, to my knowledge, plays for the sake of giving someone else the chance to kick them in the face for a few hours with a grossly lopsided advantage.

We want to incentivize otherwise weaker defenders to defend. That by necessity means that they have to see some point in trying to defend.

Griefing, in terms of individuals being killed/individuals doing the griefing should be handled on that scale. I don't think its a binary switch either. Stopping someone from doing a quest (epic, or otherwise, and of course would depend on the quest as well)? Fine. Making it a part of your game time to ensure that person never completes that quest? Well, maybe that IS inching into stupid land. (That's not a reference to the epic discussion earlier, I don't have any real idea who/what/where is involved with ANY of that, so I can't really comment on it.)

Griefing, in terms of a dominant org jumping on the face of a weaker org, all the time, to the point that it becomes detrimental to the weaker org's health in terms of player base? (Dunno if that's happening now at all, I DO know it's been a problem several times in the past.) That's a different animal, and should be handled on that scale.

If it is that lucrative to influence something that easy, wouldn't that be something worthy of being looked at?

What isn't mentioned is that it takes an incredibly in depth understanding of where, when and how to influence, as well as skewing toward the outliers to the extent that damn near every aspect of gameplay not related to pure questing/influencing isn't very viable (there are a few exceptions to the viability, ie Harbingers, etc, and even then you're looking at a lack of viability for a significant amount of time anyway). However, it isn't something that can really be pulled off without significant sacrifice, an absurd level of practice, intricate refinement of methodology, a crapload of studying the mechanics behind it and round the clock work. And fyi, it was actually closer to 76 hours, not 48, and round the clock with at most 1 hour breaks here and there, at least as far as I recall. I doubt more than 3 current players, tops, could pull it off, period, and honestly, it's not really worth it.

Lusternia is a game where you can't tell people to "learn how to fight", because of how incredibly complex the fighting system is. I personally can't fight because I'm completely code illiterate. I can't code a system. I can barely even make an alias using nexus without getting help with going through the motions. Nor can I afford to pay for a system as I can't even pay for credits for skills. As long as a basic healing system is so difficult to get, people are going to be griefed because they fall to the first guy with a web enchantment who knows how to use it.

I like the vitae grace idea. What about vitae giving you a 3-5 minute grace, but only if you have not killed or participated in killing a player in the past ?

RP: Vitae is more powerful for those adventurers who abstain from killing other adventurers.

I somehow doubt that's the problem most people have who are getting 'griefed'. Most people do have a system. Just ask someone kind to share a not-too-old Treant version with you, for instance.

To Sahmiam: I can't really believe that. There are quite a few people who bash a lot, in neutral non-Prime and enemy territory. During the greathunt, I cleared the illithoid prison several times myself. I think one of your main problems is that you don't have a gem. For everyone else who finds the bashing grounds that enemy too risky (and may not have gems, either), there are quinotaurs, rocs, manticores, krokani, aslaran, asylum, tunnel trash and probably much more that I don't even know (or can't remember right now). And loads and loads of influencing spots where you're pretty much safe.

Do we really want to encourage demigods (who have to worry the moat about enemy territory) to hunt quinotaurs and krokani? I remember being the level for those and it sucked to see some badass clearing it for cash when I just wanted to level.

so it was an actual 48 (or 76) hour marathon as opposed to a figurative 2 day time period. In that case, be my guest. I would hope that you got something out of that, though the 40-50k per hour that Eventru mentioned still seems rather high if true.

How often do you see people on Muud or in the catacombs get ganked? Hardly happens, and those are good hunting areas (that don't enemy). If they don't want to go there and are too scared for kephera or what have you, yes, then I'd encourage them to bash quinotaurs and the asylum. Or influence. Or aetherbash.
But maybe if it's demis who are the main focus of this anti-grief campaign, it's just too easy to become one in the first place...