For real, it can all be traced back to shrines.

Just think, if Thoros had not wantonly enemied people to Fain for shrines, everyone else would not have started doing the same (myself included).

If that hadn't happened, shrines would not be used most fighting circumstances.

If shrines weren't used that way, domoths would be far more contestable, we wouldn't have had to special report it, and teams would be more keen to fight fair (numbers wise at least) because they wouldn't have to worry about the other team propping up a shrine and invasioning them to death.

It's shrines all the way down, man.

I'm glad we agree. Let's do a business shake.

Congrats to Hallifax for flare efforts!

Boo to lag, awkward disconnects, and getting people killed thereby. I feel there needs to be a panic button that let's everyone know 'oh hai gaiz, I can't actually do anything'. ;_;

Svorai:

Congrats to Hallifax for flare efforts!

Boo to lag, awkward disconnects, and getting people killed thereby. I feel there needs to be a panic button that let's everyone know 'oh hai gaiz, I can't actually do anything'. ;_;

Thanks, we had fun! You guys did the right thing I think, in terms of what you were trying to do... Halli just had enough ships and good people on them. Good amounts of death throughout and at the end, so, not a total win/loss for anyone. More of this.

Re: Fair fights? I think most people would agree that smaller scale fights are usually more fun for all involved, rather than the "Oh crap, I'm being targetted! And I'm dead," types that group fights invariably turn into.

In the interests of prodding people toward more enjoyable, smaller scale fights, here are some handy 'people who turn up to fight' aka. 'hint hint' tables! You get a ? if I haven't seen you in a group fight in a while, or if you're newish to deathsight! And can be sure I'm forgetting couple of people. :)

Celest = { Malicia, Nydekion, Inagin, Draylor, Kelly, Azula, Near, Yurika(?), Neos(?), Xena(?), Ryboi(?) }
Serenwilde = { Enyalida, Lehki, Rivius, Hiriako, Turnus, Lothringen, Raeri, Sondayga, Nicholo, Elaradria(?) }
Glomdoring = { Sidd, Vadi, Xynthin, Celina, Malarious, Calesta, Elana, Svorai, Tacita, Naia(?) }
Hallifax = { Morbo, Shedrin, Ushaara, Aeden, Tulemrah, Daedalion, Lawliet, Talan, Eritheyl(?), Saleo(?), Drae(?) }
Magnagora = { Thalkros, Munsia, Revan, Llandros, Arcanis, Silvanus, Ixion(?), Marie(?), well they're not down and out yet! }
Gaudiguch = { Shuyin, Viynain, Haiden(?), Naralis(?), Svana(?) ummm... Reality, Ectoplasm, Transfix, Drunkenness, Badluck, GreyWhispers, :P }
Number wise?

#Celest = 7-11
#Serenwilde = 9-10
#Glomdoring = 9-10
#Hallifax = 8-11
#Magnagora = 6-8
#Gaudiguch = 4-5 + OPness! :P
Current setup?

#Equinox vs #Other: 20-25 vs. 9 or 11 or 8
Yes, that last is of course exaggerated, but that's what -could- be possible if you got everyone together.

As for raiders, each org seems to have about 2 or 3 people who would raid (semi-)regularly.

It's no secret that Hallifax split from IronHart alliance in bid to shake up current alliances. People want fair fights? Personally, I think most orgs can afford to drop their alliances. Certainly the first four in list there! Add a bit of ooc restraint (big ask, yes :P) and game could be whole lot more enjoyable for every org and everyone!

Whoa whoa, let's not exaggerate, Gaudiguch fields two, the rest are a stretch.

It's just an awesome two, and I like that our inherent value is not even measured in our numbers, but our skills.

.... :(

Edit:

I thought I shouldn't spell this out, but I will. (Un)fortunately, there is literally (near) zero IC reason for Equinox to split up, only OOC ones. So if you guys broke up hoping that Equinox would do the same, you might have been expecting too much. Might need to tackle that particular...issue differently.

Rivius:

No...I mean like what they did for druid/mage guilds. Allow you to imbue your pet with tracking things if you have the skill.

I think it ends up being tricky anyway, since beastmastery and tracking are pretty separate mechanics. But one can dream.

This would open the door to (the custom pet owners) being able to go mercenary. I approve.

I think Hallifax dropped IronHart because there was a small degree internal conflict and tension.

I don't think that just because you guys were unhappy, everyone else should stop break up with their friends under your banner of 'go solo!'. For example, if Gaudi does it, they'll only have 2 people really against your army, and you'll have a much easier time dealing with them. Good for you, but not for them.

tl:dr; this idea being championed by Hallifax makes no sense and is silly. Sides happen, there aren't wars with more than 2 sides in them.

Sojiro:

Just think, if Thoros had not wantonly enemied people to Fain for shrines, everyone else would not have started doing the same (myself included)

Enemying for shrines was done before Thoros ever touched foot in Magnagora. That is why Mal was enemied to Terentia.

Vadi:

I think Hallifax dropped IronHart because there was a small degree internal conflict and tension.

I don't think that just because you guys were unhappy, everyone else should stop break up with their friends under your banner of 'go solo!'. For example, if Gaudi does it, they'll only have 2 people really against your army, and you'll have a much easier time dealing with them. Good for you, but not for them.

tl:dr; this idea being championed by Hallifax makes no sense and is silly. Sides happen, there aren't wars with more than 2 sides in them.

Well I'd disagree with perceived reason for breakaway. From my own view of it, alliance could have easily stayed together for another long while. Post was effort to show that there is potential for a decision to be made which I think could make game more enjoyable. If people want to make that decision, there are then ways to make it an ic one.

For me, breaking an alliance doesn't mean breaking a friendship, it just means I don't head to Eth Seren when someone calls for help. I do realise on individual org level, Halli would be stronger than Gaudi yes, however it has had its own period as the underdog. We've been lucky and benefitted from highly active people taking interest in helping others improve.

Sides happen yes, but I guess I'm still seeing this as a game which should be enjoyable for both sides rather than a 'must win at all costs war.' Anyhoo. I've a feeling I won't be convincing you, so I'll just quit now.

Tidy tidy. Serenwilde or Gaudiguch, ponder ponder.

Vadi:

I think Hallifax dropped IronHart because there was a small degree internal conflict and tension.

I don't think that just because you guys were unhappy, everyone else should stop break up with their friends under your banner of 'go solo!'. For example, if Gaudi does it, they'll only have 2 people really against your army, and you'll have a much easier time dealing with them. Good for you, but not for them.

tl:dr; this idea being championed by Hallifax makes no sense and is silly. Sides happen, there aren't wars with more than 2 sides in them.

Admittedly I only care to nitpick the last bit, but really? There aren't wars with more than 2 sides in them? Have you read about historical wars? Pairing things down to 1 vs 1 doesn't happen. Even barring reality by claiming this is a game, at heart the number of ideological conflicts going on are far from inherently conducive to static sides -outside- of mechanic tendencies. Melee a Trois seems far more lore-centric. False dichotomy reeeeaaaaly irks me ].

And as far as I'm concerned IG, this neutrality is just a pleasant and logical extension of Hallifaxian teachings .

Edit: also being irked apparently makes me babble. tl;dr - Wars never that simple , Hallifax neutrality justified by current RP

Just because something's more lore-centric doesn't mean that it's going to be accepted by the playerbase. Expectations vs. reality.

While it would cool cool cool to have everyone fight everyone else, it's not a realistic goal because all it takes is one org to decide, "hey, this would be easier if we teamed up with org y again" and it will all collapse back into alliances once more. Plus we like our friends. I also believe that there are still some enchants/alchemy cures that are not provided by tinkering/brewmeistery that are absolutely critical to an org.

As much as I...laud, I guess, the current Hallifax leadership for stepping up and breaking things up yet again, even they will eventually be replaced, and their next leaders may feel that the current situation may not be that kosher after all.

I mean really, if the playerbase accepted the lore without forming their own interpretations of it, Serenwilde wouldn't have ostracized Hoaracle, Glomdoring would have remained Diet Mag, Hai'gloh/Xion wouldn't have happened, and so on, all of which added their own very interesting stories to the backdrop of Lusternia.

vote for hai'Gloh 2012

I miss all the cool fights and event stuff! Now I know how GMT timezone people feel all the time :(

@Maellio: You just aren't looking on the right scale, then. Think simple: for every battle and war, Wikipedia has two columns of who participated.

edit: also, what neutrality? I haven't been first time I've read about this since the initial announcement. Really haven't gotten the perception of a neutrality so far.

I have nothing to contribute to the discussion of What's A Fair Fight, Season 7, except to say "dissuage" isn't a word. I think you guys mean "dissuade". This is an almost entirely useless contribution, and I feel good about that.

Man, we really need to stop running repeats on Lusternian TV. We're clearly on to Season Eight now.

Sojiro:
Serenwilde wouldn't have ostracized Hoaracle

What.
We really didn't. Infact, we listened to what he said, which actually put a strain on us. Not that I disagree with your other points. For the most part, Hoaracle's order did as he commanded. Sure, in the end Serenwilde in general did what it felt it needed to do, but what else do you expect to happen? We certainly didn't ostracize him, and he was actually treated pretty darn well. We <3s us some Hoaracle.

Serenwilde's playerbase in referendums voted pretty overwhelmingly in favor of "lets leave Ironhart and try for peace, we're sick of how things are". So sure Equinox can stay together, other people just don't wants to play with you guys is all. :P