Ilyssa2011-07-15 14:29:41
QUOTE (Zarquan @ Jul 15 2011, 09:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Search through the M:tG elf cards, and you'll see some that are big and scary.
Not an elf, look at the feet!
Unknown2011-07-15 14:42:58
Clearly, he's just bonded with the Nature spirits.
Qistrel2011-07-15 15:03:45
QUOTE (Zarquan @ Jul 15 2011, 03:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Search through the M:tG elf cards, and you'll see some that are big and scary.
And/or riding dinosaurs.
Sylphas2011-07-15 16:25:52
QUOTE (Zarquan @ Jul 15 2011, 09:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Search through the M:tG elf cards, and you'll see some that are big and scary.
Also, if you take Tolkien as the father of the standard fantasy elf, people are so totally getting the elf thing wrong. Those bastards have been known to duel and kill balrogs, and Fingolfin fought Morgoth himself in single combat and gave him a limp he carried ever after.
Qistrel2011-07-15 18:11:30
QUOTE (Sylphas @ Jul 15 2011, 06:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
been known to duel and kill balrogs
Glorfindel...
Sylphas2011-07-15 18:35:06
Unknown2011-07-15 18:49:19
QUOTE (Sylphas @ Jul 15 2011, 01:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Also, if you take Tolkien as the father of the standard fantasy elf, people are so totally getting the elf thing wrong. Those bastards have been known to duel and kill balrogs, and Fingolfin fought Morgoth himself in single combat and gave him a limp he carried ever after.
Fingolfin and co. are High Elves. Like Galadriel and Cirdan. Elfen are more like the elves in the Mirkwood (debatably).
Anyway, humans in LotR whoop ass too. Like Beren Camlost, Turin Turambar, and Eärendil.
Unknown2011-07-15 20:49:21
I'm gonna throw in Ar-Pharazon just because the dude managed to get an army of humans so large that it threatened the Valar. Just lots of pissed off Numenoreans.
Sylphas2011-07-16 08:18:47
QUOTE (Kialkarkea @ Jul 15 2011, 04:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm gonna throw in Ar-Pharazon just because the dude managed to get an army of humans so large that it threatened the Valar. Just lots of pissed off Numenoreans.
I'm not sure if they ever actually felt threatened by Numenor, or if was just a "Seriously guys? You're going to be like that? Ok, how about now?" kind of thing. Plenty of gods in various mythologies lay all sorts of smack down on uppity mortals.
Part of the problem with this, though, is that throughout Tolkien's work the power levels vary hugely, even where they likely shouldn't. Early in his writings balrogs are pretty awesome, but still die to an elf with some skill. In LotR, it took a full blown Istari wielding a Ring to kill one, and the only reason Gandalf came back was the direct intervention of Iluvatar.
Rakor2011-07-16 09:06:08
QUOTE (Sylphas @ Jul 16 2011, 04:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm not sure if they ever actually felt threatened by Numenor, or if was just a "Seriously guys? You're going to be like that? Ok, how about now?" kind of thing. Plenty of gods in various mythologies lay all sorts of smack down on uppity mortals.
Part of the problem with this, though, is that throughout Tolkien's work the power levels vary hugely, even where they likely shouldn't. Early in his writings balrogs are pretty awesome, but still die to an elf with some skill. In LotR, it took a full blown Istari wielding a Ring to kill one, and the only reason Gandalf came back was the direct intervention of Iluvatar.
Part of the problem with this, though, is that throughout Tolkien's work the power levels vary hugely, even where they likely shouldn't. Early in his writings balrogs are pretty awesome, but still die to an elf with some skill. In LotR, it took a full blown Istari wielding a Ring to kill one, and the only reason Gandalf came back was the direct intervention of Iluvatar.
yeah, the Valar were never legitimately threatened by some men who forgot their place(s)
there were also hundreds of balrogs in the beginning, and they seemed to be less powerful than they were made out in LotR. I always found that interesting, an army of balrogs
Unknown2011-07-16 12:06:44
QUOTE (Rakor @ Jul 16 2011, 06:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
yeah, the Valar were never legitimately threatened by some men who forgot their place(s)
there were also hundreds of balrogs in the beginning, and they seemed to be less powerful than they were made out in LotR. I always found that interesting, an army of balrogs
there were also hundreds of balrogs in the beginning, and they seemed to be less powerful than they were made out in LotR. I always found that interesting, an army of balrogs
There were only ever seven Balrogs. And they were all extremely powerful, being Maiar, and having joined in Melkor's corruption of the Song of Creation. Gothmog, Morgoth's general, even slew Fëanor, who was likely the most metal elf to ever exist.
Unknown2011-07-16 12:13:46
QUOTE (Sylphas @ Jul 16 2011, 04:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Part of the problem with this, though, is that throughout Tolkien's work the power levels vary hugely, even where they likely shouldn't. Early in his writings balrogs are pretty awesome, but still die to an elf with some skill. In LotR, it took a full blown Istari wielding a Ring to kill one, and the only reason Gandalf came back was the direct intervention of Iluvatar.
Second-to-Third generation Noldorin and Elda are hardly normal elves. Many were on a similar level to the Istari. I would argue that Durin's Bane was likely flagging greatly in power, seeing as Gandalf the Grey could slay him. After all, the Witch-King of Angmar easily cowed Gandalf the White. The Istari were manipulators and guarding spirits, not warriors.
The Balrogs of the First Age could hammer through entire elven battalions by themselves, it was just the greatest of warriors who could fend them off.
Rakor2011-07-16 12:20:18
If Tolkien had lived to be twice his old we might have a real answer, but you definitely can't say there were just 7, it's too unclear
"a host of balrogs"
"the balrogs in hundreds"
"a thousand balrogs"
"there came balrogs one thousand"
etc, from the Silmarillion and lost tales
"a host of balrogs"
"the balrogs in hundreds"
"a thousand balrogs"
"there came balrogs one thousand"
etc, from the Silmarillion and lost tales
Rakor2011-07-16 12:21:09
QUOTE (Akeley @ Jul 16 2011, 08:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Second-to-Third generation Noldorin and Elda are hardly normal elves. Many were on a similar level to the Istari.
and yes this is also true
Daraius2011-07-16 12:39:11
You guys need a Tolkein thread. :/
Unknown2011-07-16 12:46:03
Ilyssa2011-07-16 13:01:17
QUOTE (Daraius @ Jul 16 2011, 08:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You guys need a Tolkein thread. :/
It should be called "An attempt to prove that elves are not pansies", and will be subtitled, "But will never be as cool as lobos".
Unknown2011-07-16 13:03:55
(Sorry. I'll stop now.)
Elostian2011-07-16 15:42:11
Who are these guys?
Unknown2011-07-16 15:43:50
I picked that one because the filename quietly gave it away.