Enyalida2012-01-24 00:14:37
Thornrend also takes power to do, and stops you from using the insta, as well as being several balances to pull off. Not to mention that if you can get off even a single lash thornrend you might as well just kill them with four, because it's not actually possible to lash someone and get balance back before they writhe it. They obviously just aren't writhing.You may be able to barely scrape by as Mugwump, but even then....
Unknown2012-01-24 00:15:15
He specifically meant allowing lashes to work in sap, but replacing instakill thornrend with heavy bleeding in sap.
Enyalida2012-01-24 00:20:53
Ah well. That would be fine, though any time spent using lashes is not time spent perpetuating sap, which you really need to spend all of your time doing against a competent opponent. I guess if the other sap changes go through, this could be a viable option.
Enyalida2012-01-30 06:11:40
I know it's very last minute here, and if things really wont allow for it, that's fine, but could we possibly add what I've talked about here:
Yes, I'm aware there is an artifact that performs the same function, just as there is an artifact that replicates the mage's abilities. Having similar protections in their natural environment (in the trees) will help lend parity to the odd Druid Mage relationship.
Even with the suggested changes to druid mechanics in the special report as it stands, druids will be a heavily timing-and-risk-based class. The introduction of yet another random factor into this will have big negative effects for the druid, that cannot be addressed through the druid's skills. The existence of an artifact to do this thing is no excuse for not having the ability. The artifact would remain as a way for non-druids to mimic a portion of the druid's innate connection with the trees, allowing them too to sway with the trees instead of being knocked down by mere wind, just as the elemental rings exist for the mage skills (and the nose for the totems skill, and the pogo for leaping skills, and the compass for majorsixth, and the sandals for celerity skills, and the maw for burrowing and so on).
From a balance point of view, the mages all have an ability that aides them in escaping the natural perils of their respective terrains. Druids require combat in the trees. Cling is not a viable method to remain in the trees in any battle that does not take place in a single room on a single elevation (which is all battles), as it takes eq to function. This 'treebourne' skill would not make the druid immune to knockdown abilities such as highjump, wiccan sylph, hexagram, crow construct knockdown, or geyser. It would also not make the druid immune to being knocked out of the sky by natural wind or any of these methods. It would simply allow a druid, who is not being assaulted by a skill designed to knock them down, to utilize their demesne's terrain abilities without fear of going off balance due to random natural knockdown, which will almost surely give the target enough time to cure sap (even with the changes proposed).
From a thematic and RP perspective, it simply dosn't make sense that someone who is one of "the guardians of the forests" and who can "the guardians of the forests" would be knocked down randomly. The theme of the skill would be that the druid is connected to the very ethereal core of the trees, and therefore simply sways in time with their movements during high winds.
Estarra:
Regarding Report 599 (druid immunity to weather wind knock down), that was specifically tabled because of ongoing review of weather.
Yes, I'm aware there is an artifact that performs the same function, just as there is an artifact that replicates the mage's abilities. Having similar protections in their natural environment (in the trees) will help lend parity to the odd Druid Mage relationship.
Even with the suggested changes to druid mechanics in the special report as it stands, druids will be a heavily timing-and-risk-based class. The introduction of yet another random factor into this will have big negative effects for the druid, that cannot be addressed through the druid's skills. The existence of an artifact to do this thing is no excuse for not having the ability. The artifact would remain as a way for non-druids to mimic a portion of the druid's innate connection with the trees, allowing them too to sway with the trees instead of being knocked down by mere wind, just as the elemental rings exist for the mage skills (and the nose for the totems skill, and the pogo for leaping skills, and the compass for majorsixth, and the sandals for celerity skills, and the maw for burrowing and so on).
From a balance point of view, the mages all have an ability that aides them in escaping the natural perils of their respective terrains. Druids require combat in the trees. Cling is not a viable method to remain in the trees in any battle that does not take place in a single room on a single elevation (which is all battles), as it takes eq to function. This 'treebourne' skill would not make the druid immune to knockdown abilities such as highjump, wiccan sylph, hexagram, crow construct knockdown, or geyser. It would also not make the druid immune to being knocked out of the sky by natural wind or any of these methods. It would simply allow a druid, who is not being assaulted by a skill designed to knock them down, to utilize their demesne's terrain abilities without fear of going off balance due to random natural knockdown, which will almost surely give the target enough time to cure sap (even with the changes proposed).
From a thematic and RP perspective, it simply dosn't make sense that someone who is one of "the guardians of the forests" and who can "the guardians of the forests" would be knocked down randomly. The theme of the skill would be that the druid is connected to the very ethereal core of the trees, and therefore simply sways in time with their movements during high winds.
Qistrel2012-01-30 07:06:49
Sojiro:
-Have sap kill you after 30s of not curing it, make it leave a cool corpse like with geomancy fossils (Shuyin's remains are here, preserved in hardened sap).
I think you mean amber. :D
Ytran2012-01-30 08:34:48
I think you mean amber. :D
Amber is fossilised resin, not sap.
Qistrel2012-01-30 09:13:50
Learn something new evey day.
Enyalida2012-01-30 09:21:45
Though, the message for sap could be indicating the secretion of resin instead of actual sap. It sort of makes more sense also, as squirting out sap is depriving the tree of its nutrients, though only slightly.
Ytran2012-01-30 17:51:01
Enyalida:
Though, the message for sap could be indicating the secretion of resin instead of actual sap. It sort of makes more sense also, as squirting out sap is depriving the tree of its nutrients, though only slightly.
Sure, but then you can't have a kill message involving drowning someone in maple syrup.
Unknown2012-01-30 17:58:08
Ytran:
Sure, but then you can't have a kill message involving drowning someone in maple syrup.
Why not?
Joking aside, it wouldn't be fossilized in any even if it were resin, so it wouldn't be amber.
Enyalida2012-01-30 19:03:49
Oh, psh. Why would it not be fossilized?
Unknown2012-01-30 19:24:31
Enyalida:
Oh, psh. Why would it not be fossilized?
Because you aren't a geomancer. Duh.
Enyalida2012-02-12 03:20:57
CLANHELP DRUIDISH
Come on, anyone? It'll really help with the upcoming second wave of special reporting, as we'll need to be organizing new druid mechanics!
Come on, anyone? It'll really help with the upcoming second wave of special reporting, as we'll need to be organizing new druid mechanics!
Xenthos2012-02-12 03:26:42
Enyalida:
CLHELP DRUIDISH.
Come on, anyone? It'll really help with the upcoming second wave of special reporting, as we'll need to be organizing new druid mechanics!
No such clanhelp file found.
(CLANHELP DRUIDISH works better)
Enyalida2012-02-12 03:32:02
Oops, that's what I meant to post. I fixed it.
Svorai2012-02-12 03:44:57
I'd rather hash things out in an OOC manner on the forums where everyone can contribute and outline their ideas in an easier format. We're not all here when things might be discussed on a clan, so I think it's best to have things here, where we can have time to think about what's being discussed.
(Also, my clan slots are full and I don't feel like shelling out 25cr for it. Plus, a clan like this isn't IC and asking ICly ruffled my feathers, so to speak.)
(Also, my clan slots are full and I don't feel like shelling out 25cr for it. Plus, a clan like this isn't IC and asking ICly ruffled my feathers, so to speak.)
Enyalida2012-02-12 04:10:25
Druidish is as OOC clan. The thing is that it will serve as a place where we can throw out our ideas and get feedback on them (on news boards) without as much fear of trolling. In the past, attempts to coordinate with the other druid envoy (across the pond) fell totally flat because there wasn't any sort of active method of doing so in an organized and recordable medium.
I get so frustrated and tired of having to explain basic druid mechanics and realities (learned from playing for 2 years as a Dreamweaver/Ecologist/Shaman druid) to people thousands of times, and I'm sure everyone else does. If there is a place where we (druids) can forumulate fully polished and thought out ideas before submitting them to the general populace for feedback before submitting them formally to envoys for feedback before submitting them to the admins for their decisions and feedback, it will greatly cut down on the amount of misunderstandings that perpetuate, circulating on the forums.
Similarly, having a centralized location to dump our respective envoy plans, so that we can compare notes and envoy things, that can be updated more or less real time, and discussed at length in real time, would be a real boon to us envoys. Having the rest of our guildmembers who have any interest be privy to these discussions will help us gauge our concerns against the concerns of those that also have to play with the skills, as well as help stimulate a new flow of ideas. I'd like to point out that not everyone frequents the forums, and those that do don't necessarily want to post in threads that often run to large and in-depth (intimidating) posts, like class threads often do! Having it be more personable and accessable is a step to help avoid alienating guildmembers.
If it's a matter of funds, I'm sure I/we could scrape up a fund to help subsidize clanslot permits, if we really must.
I get so frustrated and tired of having to explain basic druid mechanics and realities (learned from playing for 2 years as a Dreamweaver/Ecologist/Shaman druid) to people thousands of times, and I'm sure everyone else does. If there is a place where we (druids) can forumulate fully polished and thought out ideas before submitting them to the general populace for feedback before submitting them formally to envoys for feedback before submitting them to the admins for their decisions and feedback, it will greatly cut down on the amount of misunderstandings that perpetuate, circulating on the forums.
Similarly, having a centralized location to dump our respective envoy plans, so that we can compare notes and envoy things, that can be updated more or less real time, and discussed at length in real time, would be a real boon to us envoys. Having the rest of our guildmembers who have any interest be privy to these discussions will help us gauge our concerns against the concerns of those that also have to play with the skills, as well as help stimulate a new flow of ideas. I'd like to point out that not everyone frequents the forums, and those that do don't necessarily want to post in threads that often run to large and in-depth (intimidating) posts, like class threads often do! Having it be more personable and accessable is a step to help avoid alienating guildmembers.
If it's a matter of funds, I'm sure I/we could scrape up a fund to help subsidize clanslot permits, if we really must.
Svorai2012-02-12 05:35:30
Someone you contacted mentioned it in an IC fashion, so I assumed you asked them in that manner, also.
While I'm not as good of a druid combatant as the likes of Sidd, Vadi and yourself, and may not be able to contribute so much with balance issues, I am passionate about my guild's skills and what changes might be made to it. I know there are others in this basket in the BT. The result of the Special Report opens up an opportunity for us to add new flavour skills, and that's exciting.
My concern is that things can and will be discussed on this clan and those of us who cannot be present (or present at the same time as others in the clan) who have relevant and important things to add, will miss out on the opportunity to relay their ideas if the moment's passed. If it's somewhere out of Lusternia, ie - here, or maybe a Google site, it can be logged and people can go over what's been discussed at their convenience.
Anyway. If you really want to use the clan, I'm sure it will be used. Just raising this concern. I'll use Vadi as a proxy, however.
While I'm not as good of a druid combatant as the likes of Sidd, Vadi and yourself, and may not be able to contribute so much with balance issues, I am passionate about my guild's skills and what changes might be made to it. I know there are others in this basket in the BT. The result of the Special Report opens up an opportunity for us to add new flavour skills, and that's exciting.
My concern is that things can and will be discussed on this clan and those of us who cannot be present (or present at the same time as others in the clan) who have relevant and important things to add, will miss out on the opportunity to relay their ideas if the moment's passed. If it's somewhere out of Lusternia, ie - here, or maybe a Google site, it can be logged and people can go over what's been discussed at their convenience.
Anyway. If you really want to use the clan, I'm sure it will be used. Just raising this concern. I'll use Vadi as a proxy, however.
Enyalida2012-02-12 06:12:44
Yes well. Mentioning it occasionally on Market (also IC, I'll probably be doing this more anyways) and leaving multiple beckons on forums, asking for members didn't work. It's generally a better idea to ask people reasonably IC if they want to join a clan, and point them to the CLANHELPS about it then to bust in with the double brackets straight away. I'm fairly new at recruiting for a clan also, I'm not really sure how to go about doing it. If you're seriously not going to join, or are going to be in a huff because you've got a bee in your bonnet about me sending you a tell, I'm not sure how to respond. I'm sorry, I guess?
Anything that is serious (just as on the forums, or envoys) will be done in a commentable fashion, like the news boards. Conversations happen on Envoys and pass by if you aren't there, that's just a fact of how life works that everyone has to deal with, if you aren't around, you aren't around! That dosn't mean that the forums will be ignored, or that envoys will be (this is impossible anyways). So I'm a bit confused on that front, it's not like this is going to bypass Envoys in any way. It's just a way for you, the guild members, to be in better contact with us, the envoys. It also will help us, the envoys, know what the other druids think about how our skills interact with any possible druidry/tert changes.
Besides using the news boards, I also plan to make strategic use of CLHELPS to both disseminate information, as in the case of my 'Trances' and 'Weather' writeups covering my research on both topics and my compiled 'help files' on how to explain both mechanics to the average druid/player, and to gather opinions on possible envoy topics. I will be putting my list of envoy reports for shamanism up on a CLHELP for instance, and request discussion on possible problems in the reports, or alternate ideas. Of course, I will urge Sidd to make similar use, or use any of the functions of the clan to do whatever he pleases to that end! I'm automatically going to put the Hartstone Champ, Sidd, and the Blacktalon champ all at the highest perm level (Everything but bankaccounts, though they are empty), and let them allocate or possibly even create positions as they want to make the clan run better.
I understand credit crunch though, and of course, you are willing to handle things however you want. I just hope that the idea of having some place to mull over ideas with other druids with the functionality provided by a clan isn't dismissed as useless without considerable thought, I really feel that it is a valuable opportunity.
Anything that is serious (just as on the forums, or envoys) will be done in a commentable fashion, like the news boards. Conversations happen on Envoys and pass by if you aren't there, that's just a fact of how life works that everyone has to deal with, if you aren't around, you aren't around! That dosn't mean that the forums will be ignored, or that envoys will be (this is impossible anyways). So I'm a bit confused on that front, it's not like this is going to bypass Envoys in any way. It's just a way for you, the guild members, to be in better contact with us, the envoys. It also will help us, the envoys, know what the other druids think about how our skills interact with any possible druidry/tert changes.
Besides using the news boards, I also plan to make strategic use of CLHELPS to both disseminate information, as in the case of my 'Trances' and 'Weather' writeups covering my research on both topics and my compiled 'help files' on how to explain both mechanics to the average druid/player, and to gather opinions on possible envoy topics. I will be putting my list of envoy reports for shamanism up on a CLHELP for instance, and request discussion on possible problems in the reports, or alternate ideas. Of course, I will urge Sidd to make similar use, or use any of the functions of the clan to do whatever he pleases to that end! I'm automatically going to put the Hartstone Champ, Sidd, and the Blacktalon champ all at the highest perm level (Everything but bankaccounts, though they are empty), and let them allocate or possibly even create positions as they want to make the clan run better.
I understand credit crunch though, and of course, you are willing to handle things however you want. I just hope that the idea of having some place to mull over ideas with other druids with the functionality provided by a clan isn't dismissed as useless without considerable thought, I really feel that it is a valuable opportunity.
