Lothringen:

If I understand correctly, I feel that making wounding afflictions smarter is a good buff for one-handers but relatively useless for two-handers. If you leg tendon left leg, there's really no point in hitting left leg again when you could attempt to leg tendon right leg. If it's amputated, getting leg tendon is useless (and impossible? I don't actually know, but I assume you can't wound a non-existent limb!) on the same leg, as is lacerate.

As a whole, I like and agree with the changes, but I'm wondering if there's a solution for two-handers that would benefit them as much as one-handers as far as "smarter wounding" is concerned.

My thinking was it would help in those times when you are trying to amputate an already tendoned leg, but the swing triggers tendon again. Would be more noticeable buff for 1-handers alright, as already said.

Not too sure on the diminishing returns on armour... mostly because you runed-out-the-ass warriors can easily build wounds to a high degree even if your opponent is parry/stancing well. While this would be an excellent change for non-runed warriors that I'd support... I can't justify this change for runed warriors at all

Revan:

Not too sure on the diminishing returns on armour... mostly because you runed-out-the-ass warriors can easily build wounds to a high degree even if your opponent is parry/stancing well. While this would be an excellent change for non-runed warriors that I'd support... I can't justify this change for runed warriors at all

65-70 is right around where warriors have to start working to build wounds, so that's a good level to start diminishing returns at, in 70's you'll still be having pretty good protection

well, there's also the problem that "anything over 100 doesn't give protection".. which makes getting an artifact shield utterly worthless. You can easily get to 100 with a normal shield and good splendors...n why nerf an artifact when runed warriors already build wounds rather well against splendor+shield rune?

Edit: And then, on the flipside... get a shield rune... but then what good are splendors? Might as well just have crappy 50/50 robes. This change, again, would be great and needed for non-runed warriors... but this should never ever go into effect for runed-warriors. I'm not sure how we could implement this without warriors going absolutely nuts and raping everyone like the days of 2-hit beheads... and let's not even talk about groups

Revan:

well, there's also the problem that "anything over 100 doesn't give protection".. which makes getting an artifact shield utterly worthless. You can easily get to 100 with a normal shield and good splendors...n why nerf an artifact when runed warriors already build wounds rather well against splendor+shield rune?

Edit: And then, on the flipside... get a shield rune... but then what good are splendors? Might as well just have crappy 50/50 robes. This change, again, would be great and needed for non-runed warriors... but this should never ever go into effect for runed-warriors. I'm not sure how we could implement this without warriors going absolutely nuts and raping everyone like the days of 2-hit beheads... and let's not even talk about groups

I think you're forgetting how shields work you don't get the full 52/52 added to your stats, you only get ....1/2 of the total value maybe? I don't remember off hand, but it's not 100%. Also, it doesn't protect legs at all and only one arm.

Edit, it is only half, so 26 which means even at 75/75 splendours (really good), you're still getting a some benefit

Actually, the reduction does not apply to the artifact runes

Revan:

well, there's also the problem that "anything over 100 doesn't give protection".. which makes getting an artifact shield utterly worthless. You can easily get to 100 with a normal shield and good splendors...n why nerf an artifact when runed warriors already build wounds rather well against splendor+shield rune?

Edit: And then, on the flipside... get a shield rune... but then what good are splendors? Might as well just have crappy 50/50 robes. This change, again, would be great and needed for non-runed warriors... but this should never ever go into effect for runed-warriors. I'm not sure how we could implement this without warriors going absolutely nuts and raping everyone like the days of 2-hit beheads... and let's not even talk about groups

If I recall correctly, people with 50/50 robes do not die to two-hit beheads. In any case, Sidd is right that 70/70 is where you need to start to work for it, and diminishing returns could start to really scale from there. I also doubt very many runed warriors can build on decent robes and curing solo.

I'm baffled anyone could see this as "too much" when I see that to be able to please the artifact-splendour group, unruned warriors will probably still need runes and demigod if splendours are mostly unaffected.

Revan:

Actually, the reduction does not apply to the artifact runes

It definitely does, I don't know where you got this

You've never fought Ixion or Thalkros.. or even Kelly then :P They build wounds really well... ixion most of all. He's not a complete and utter beast of pure mayhem for no reason

Sidd:


It definitely does, I don't know where you got this

I got this from the very announce post where they made the change... they stated specifically that shield rune artifacts would never be reduced in effectiveness. I'm not sure where you get your information from, but please triplecheck it

apparently I was wrong, my bad, but that should be changed too

I was 90% sure it only effected normal shields as well. I distinctly remember a lot of bitching about it, because we asked for a nerf to the artifact and everything else got nerfed.

Why? it's an artifact you pay 450 credits for... that's the very reason why they stated that shield runes would not be affected :P

Revan:

You've never fought Ixion or Thalkros.. or even Kelly then :P They build wounds really well... ixion most of all. He's not a complete and utter beast of pure mayhem for no reason

Of course I have. It was my spars with Ixion that taught me a lot about wound curing, stancing and parrying. Most people do it fairly terribly and that lies on them. Ixion builds well but he is pretty min/maxed. Even then, I have a feeling he wouldn't be able to work a behead on say, Fillin. I've seen him wreck even other plated warriors and then tie with Lothringen in fights. It just seems clear to me that the problem isn't really a lack of armour. Not entirely anyway.

The issue of trueshield + splendours being made less effective is fair, but it really has been giving a ton of protection to that arm than it probably should, IMO. Plus, I feel that having a permanent shield you never have to worry about buying makes it worthwhile already and doesn't it help with bashing too?

What I'm not sure about is how much protection it gives to the head/chest/gut as well.

If we can get some numbers from Iosai, then we can make a better suggestion that will address this.

I've always wondered... Why would you be attacking arms anyways? Sure, you can amputate, but go for legs so that you can prone people reliably! /offtopic

Enyalida:

I've always wondered... Why would you be attacking arms anyways? Sure, you can amputate, but go for legs so that you can prone people reliably! /offtopic

Most people stance legs, parry head, so you need to pull parry/stancing away from the legs, PB/BM has some good arm afflictions going on (hemi and collapsed nerve prevent standing as well as tendon) so building on arms and legs can prolong proning even longer

I warn about changing too many things at once.

Current report says:
- Increase wounding by adjusting armor
- Increase how often you hit areas
- Remove the ability to proc an aff that has no purpose being doubled from doing so.

So if you hit 15% more often for 10% more wounds with no risk of doubling an aff....... this sounds to me like it is huge amounts of buffs. If warriors can kill now under this they would be outright crazy. I do not see a problem with adjusting warriors a little but doing too much is bad. With high armor they can 1 shot heavy, with mroe wounds and the first attack causing the lower aff they can much much more readily guarantee higher end afflictions earlier. That is my take and its 1:30 am so I have been up a long time.

May I also recommend that two-hand specs proc affs more often than 1-handers to equal out 1-handers faster afflicting rate?

The important things here are adding diminishing returns to high-end armour and increasing the % of areas hit for bashing/slashing, in my opinion. "Smarter" wounds (and the equivilant increased effectiveness for two-handers, if that flies) is an interesting idea, but I don't think it's really necessary.

I'd suggest being cautious and going for the first two changes, then re-visiting the smarter wounds concept later if warriors are still struggling... perhaps through the regular envoy system?