Shuyin's suggestions go well over and above what's required. The system isn't broken, the players are simply jaded and the base is thinned out.

1. Remove bubblixes from stage 2, put people on more of an even ground. (mentioned this in another thread)

2. Keep absolving and domoths as is but only allow the challenging org to take part. However, I would like some way to ensure that only one org can try and usurp the challenger. Then you get your one org vs one org joy.

Zarquan:

Doesn't it also ensure that if you're not good at all three, you'll get screwed on one of them?

That's what I was thinking.

Also, org vs org by no means ensures that the odds are even. The amount of demi+ player combatants can vary a lot.
1vs1 might be too small in scope to lead to any fighting all, and I have the feeling that greatpentagram will dominate the scene. However, ANY change to make stage 3 more interesting is a step forward; right now, it is the most boring of the stages. These days, with the easier bashing, it's not a challenge for anyone but new demigods, even at crown level.

Vadi:

Nothing in the Domoths changed that made them be boring - it's the players that did. Changing Domoths will unlikely change the scene.

Changes might still encourage people to participate more, or at least make it more interesting for those who already participate.

Morbo: Adjusting the domoth system to Hallifax' current political situation or to your personal idea of how every org in the game should behave diplomatically goes a little far. It's really getting tiring to hear of it, too. Not that it really belongs in this thread, but Hallifax' behaviour towards other orgs really reeks of opportunism: You are in one alliance with Celest and Glomdoring, a relatively weak org, but you want villages/domoths. You don't get them, so you run off to Magnagora/Serenwilde who are willing to let you have them. Then, as soon as Hallifax gains strength and Magnagora is losing active players, Hallifax declares independence, since the allies are of too little use now. See, that's the situation you got yourself into, and if noone wants to ally with you any more for this or other reasons, deal with it.

Still: There have been plenty of upgrades where I was present and where we had 4-5 people upgrading, often at least half of those are noncoms. Aerys, Iasmos or Morbo may even drop onto the bubble to check out the situation, but NEVER do anything afterwards - why not? Does it require a single person to sit there for you to try? Or if you don't intend to try at all, why even bother to check us out? You guys are just too scared, really.

My suggestions are necessary because if you implement org vs. org as it is, I'll just ask Glomdoring to challenge my claim if I'm upgrading, for example.

Sojiro:

My suggestions are necessary because if you implement org vs. org as it is, I'll just ask Glomdoring to challenge my claim if I'm upgrading, for example.

I see what you're getting at but I don't think they'd help at all. You have to admit that most times, the very players here complaining about domoths tend to habitually avoid conflict at all costs unless they have an extreme upper hand and still complain about the other side dominating everything. I've been on at times when we have VERY FEW people challenging and are at risk for a takeover and the opposition does not even try. We do not always have the upper hand. I've upgraded at crown stage with 3 people and plenty of enemies online. So why uproot the system for people who don't care?

Please don't get me wrong. I'm not for blowout victories. I love challenging situations. I hate huge raiding parties, sprawling overwhelming melds and so on. I have to sometimes discourage the one melder Celest has from actually...melding because I don't want the opposition to adopt the 'oh well, they'll leave when they're bored' stance and refuse to defend. I find domoths boring but I remember when they were fun. When people fought over them. When Magnagora had Fillin and Thoros wrecking everyone and challenging was a scary thing. Now that Mag has fizzled out a bit, you have people complaining about the system when its the players that make it work.

I'm not sure of a way to introduce allowing one org vs one org in domoths that isn't gamable short of having an admin/god hit the allow challenge button which isn't going to happen.

If the cost is too steep nobody will challenge, if its non-existant then it'll be abusable.

Tying the cost to constructs I'm especially against. As that's more of a "the rich getting richer" type mechanic.

Right, that's why there are costs to challenge. If there are no costs, you'll just get constantly challenged.

If you're going to steal, you should be willing to put some stakes into it.

To me, it's really a design question for the admin to consider. Are domoths meant to be an org vs org system, or is it just supposed to be a mechanical conflict system for demis to sate their bloodlust? If the former, limiting absolves to the two orgs holding those domoths make sense. If the later, then the current free for all seems fine. I really have no opinion on which would be best, but I have thought more about ways to improve it as an org vs org mechanic. If it wasn't so easily gamable, I would say limit even challenges to the two holding orgs. Probably keep stage two open to everyone, for steals, but making stage one more limited could give smaller forces more of a chance. Again, this is only if the admin intend for domoths to be mostly org vs org, and it's not very well thought out. Just my random thoughts.

Out of curiosity, anybody have any sort of numbers on how many domoth claims/upgrades in the past say week have been contested out of many claims/upgrades there were?

I have no problem with absolves being org vs. org only, incidentally.

That seems like a very simple solution and would improve domoths. Not as much as I personally would like, but any improvement is better than none at all.

That still doesn't make Hallifax any less opportunistic and amusing given they've expressed no support for this idea until their recent independence thing, however.

Making random periods of time where you can absolve and improve a domoth simply rewards off peak times, or orgs with huge populations at normal prime where others may not have it. It also requires the holder be present.

As I have said before, aetherships should not be involved in domoths, bad idea.

Remove dormancy time is ok though.

Malarious:

Making random periods of time where you can absolve and improve a domoth simply rewards off peak times

On the contrary: Right now, you can absolve and upgrade ALWAYS off peak (once dormancy is over). Random windows would mean you might have to upgrade at peak hours or generally at times when it is not convenient for you.

I am in support of removing bubblixes from the equation. And shrines.

I think it won't fix things now, mostly because problems now stem from player apathy more so than mechanics, but from back when I used to play and fight, the bubblixes and shrines really made the domoths less fun. (And even though people can say they've seen me around, I'm not really back. I didn't have a raze form until a few days ago.)

I stopped caring about fighting in Domoth battles (yes, I know, you're all surprised) after transporting into shrine/traps/meld/etc several times. We've been so overwhelmed in a few attempts that our whole party is dead in a matter of seconds, before we even know what hit us. Pretty demoralizing. (Yes, I know. "Suck it up and you'll eventually prevail.")

There are imbalances created by code, admins, and players alike. Some are more easily overcome than others. The harder ones are frustrating enough to create that soul-crushing apathy and mind-numbing bitterness about which we sometimes speak.

(Disclaimer: I'm an anomaly who loves to code and not so much to fight. I want to advance and achieve, but the conflict avenues irritate me and others.)

I don't feel bubblixes make a difference one way or another, I've seen domoth fights where the opponent flies back each and every time, time and time again until it's over and domoth fights where despite having a bubblix, the opponent gives up after one go. Sure, it's easier if you have a bubblix, but you can still fly, bubbles aren't that hard to get to

Just because you can point out instances where flying worked and bubblixes didn't doesn't mean that there's not an advantage there. To say that there isn't one is ignoring the mechanical differences between a bubblix (instant transportation with no cool down to and from) versus ship ( may have to fly if no teleports, teleports take time and ship power, if the ship explodes, everyone dies and is lost).

Bringing up instances in which ships won the day and bubblixes didn't does nothing except misdirect the conversation. And besides, if they don't make a difference, remove them from domoths so the losing side can't cite them as one of the reasons why they lost.

Sidd:

Sure, it's easier if you have a bubblix, but you can still fly, bubbles aren't that hard to get to

Talking about misdirection while ignoring a statement I made is misdirection itself, trying to reduce my credibility, and ignoring the point (turns out, you just reduce your own credibility).

How does bringing up instances of people being able to fly and win domoths misdirect? It points out that bubblixes are -not- the cause for the lack of domoths changing hands and lack of domoth fighting. Yes, there is an advantage, but it's not a auto-win advantage, trying to say otherwise is disingenuous.

This just seems like some sort of game-changing personal victory that accomplishes nothing. I don't think removing bubblixes from domoths will help in the slightest, in fact, I think it will make things worse, and cause less fighting and even less changing of hands.

I feel like even if bubblixes were removed, the naysayers would move next to disabling flashpoints (omg it's so high up in Aethercraft, not everyone can afford a ship, etc.)

Next thing you know we'd have to move the whole system to Muud. Wildnodes 2.0?

Rampant hyperbole is such an enormous problem in Lusternia that it's going to shut down the game within the month. If we approve this slippery slope, we'll be trying to track down the IRE servers for destruction next!

Sojiro:

I have no problem with absolves being org vs. org only, incidentally.

That seems like a very simple solution and would improve domoths. Not as much as I personally would like, but any improvement is better than none at all.

That still doesn't make Hallifax any less opportunistic and amusing given they've expressed no support for this idea until their recent independence thing, however.

Whatever about Hallifax being opportunistic, the 'no support for this idea until independence' is false. Same idea was brought up during last discussion on domoths while we were still part of alliance and was supported then.

Anyhoo back to my old gripe, if domoths are revisited, I hope that orgs not currently holding a domoth will have a way to be proactive about changing domoth status, rather than always having to react/steal. Personal preference is for ascendants of orgs not currently holding a domoth being able to initiate a challenge, maybe including weakening of each domoth concept so only particular domoths can be challenged. Attach power cost to org for initiating the challenge.

'A crashing resounds throughout the firmanent as Shedrin, channelling the energies of the Matrix, attempts to absolve the Domoth of Knowledge.' etc.

Domoth Feelings.