Yes, I literally die in 5 seconds unless I use one of my escape methods.

As far as I am aware, you can't use Buck to mangle outside of a Kata, it just does damage and wounds.

You can't. It doesn't work. But the ka cost is 250 which means that I can just do it every kata.

Delete monks. Simple, effective solution.

Provided you have high enough momentum to lose a level and or hit with Shotah which does nothing and can often miss, then yes, maybe you can mangle over and over. But then that isn't what I call fighting anyways.

No, you can do it on the opening move. And then again. And then again. It's for group combat. The cure delay makes it destroy them with a good group.

Ah, well maybe then they should make that if you are using a skill that steals momentum then you shouldn't be able to do it without momentum.

8/10 Warriors agree, deleting monks is the best solution...

What I want to know is what the other two are smoking, and where to get it.

I highly doubt they will ever delete monks, so

Getting regen affs on the first attack with no effort or cost does seem a bit off.

Edit: And don't try to turn this around and say warriors can do it, sure some warriors can do it with full arties and at the cost of 7 power.

Comparing it to warriors isn't of much use in the other direction either, since it's not like you can do anything while manglewhoring in this way (unlike warriors who can do other afflictions and actual damage/wounds/poisons simultaneously). Asmodea's solution seems better than the one I'd been considering, which was upping the ka cost by 25.

You say that as if warriors mangle whore every attack and still hit with 3-4 other afflictions. I know for a fact that monks can't just mangle only in an attack. I've seen it. Trust me. Honestly, Shiri, quit getting defensive every time someone makes a statement about how off monks are. Warriors aren't even comparable to momentum.

No...I don't say that at all. I say you can't really compare them and then explain why. Sheesh, looks like I'm not the one being defensive here, especially since you're the one that brought it up in the first place...

EDIT: Btw, I specifically said "in this way" so your statement that monks can't just mangle only in an attack is irrelevant. The only other situation in which it's an obvious problem for Shofangi, at least, is when you combo it with shotah, and that's even easier to fix than the single-kata spamming. Ninjakari and Tahtetso may well be another matter though.

Wait, wait.

Why does the mangle-ability even cost 250 ka in the first place instead of the, say, 500 ka it should be costing?

Weirdos.

No idea actually, I seem to remember it being suggested in the region of 400...

So why not suggest it back to that 400 instead of to 275?

If it's not broken, don't fix it, I guess. If you can't loop it, everyone'd need a better case to be made that it's overpowering in same way. It'd hurt Shofangi quite a bit and need to be compensated for, so without that case it seems better to just leave it.

It wouldn't be completely unreasonable though.

EDIT: And if you're asking why it wasn't fixed during monk testing...no one noticed I guess! You're the first person to mention it.

So, lets see...

Shofangi can mangle whore in groups and wreck somebody. And they're the "weakest" of monk specs.

Ninjarkari were designed without even a passing regard for balance and get high end warrior afflictions really easily. (Moreso since monks aren't plagued with the mechanic known as "swing", which is basically saying "take whatever your probability of the wound you want landing is, and divide it by three or so.)

Tahetso had an "I know you are but what am I" moment before Ninjakari came out and wound up with crazy willpower draining powers and such.

Nekotai were true locking people with sever spine in three rounds until the last report. Now they still lock you in three rounds, but you can get out by burning a power cure. Also, they're hard to use poisons on, and can mask their own.


...yeah, delete monks. Really.

I don't envy the envoys who are working on this crap.

Yes, yes. The monks need an upgrade.

... /sarcasm.

Admittedly, it would put them at a lower OP standing than thier other monk friends, but I figure we can just nerf the lot of them, instead.