There's the thing, you -had- people, they just all QQ'd out, so lets not hear that. And thank you for proving that nobody in Celest cares for the constructs, or too scared to at least give defending a try. And by try and mean not going in single-file.

Given all the advantages to scaling punishments to orgs with the frequency of raids, what issues do you foresee besides the inability to "harden up"?

EDIT:
Quick recap
- The issue transcends individual organizations, as multiple organizations have been in the same situation before
- Precedence>> Supposedly, constructs already have a system to scale rewards/punishments to the frequency of raids
- In this model, raiders still get the pleasure of killing things while defenders are not heavily punished for lack of activity
- Allows orgs time/chance to recuperate + rebuild their resources even though raids may not cease
- Slows the widening divide in organizational resources between the winners and losers
- Indirectly promotes organizational conflict/activity as competition remains closer
- Lack of admin oversight needed may be seen as a plus

I guess that is where we differ, trying to defend, in my opinion, is worth the xp loss etc. I wasn't in Celest knowing what is going on, true, but I was destroying constructs seeing no one even attempting to defend. I didn't say anything about getting grace and getting into the constructs, I said people should have tried to defend. I didn't deny they would die, it was more than likely that they would, multiple times, we were prepared, but again, death has never phased me, which maybe makes it different for me as well. It's a game, I don't care about xp or anything, even before I was raised. Only reason I want to get essence is I think omniscience would be nifty, but I'd still be willing to fight and die dozens of times.

Hey fellas, Lusternia is the easiest IRE to make/retain xp in. Maybe Imperian comes close, ymmv.

I agree with Sidd, any effort is better than none at all. Regardless of what you think, it does make a difference.

P.S. 4 hour raids make it ever so difficult feeling bad for the poor, downtrodden cities that evil Eventru griefs into doing things they regret later on.

Damn school making me use a computer without my system.

-stuck on nexus until then-

5 - 6 people != 2 orgs.

Talkan comes close, I suppose, but I voted for the shrubbery.

EDIT: The people I'm thinking of are probably the only people left in either Celest or Magnagora who would/could raid anything for such a prolonged period of time. I've noticed more than six people from Mag and Celest on deathsense, but I doubt they would endure for a long time without eventually stopping.

So, what happens if the major weakening happens when there are no security online? What do you do then?

Nothing. You sit there and you watch all your constructs die. That's the problem with how it works right now.

How can you possibly justify losing all of your constructs in one weakening just because you didn't have any security online as fair? (Yes, I realize this isn't quite what happened in Celest's case, but it's certainly not unheard of.)

No, you go and fight them and try to prevent it, the unmanned constructs took out two colossi by themselves, with bombarders and people focusing negative on the construct and positive on the colossi, imagine if you get a group of people and go and fight them and pull away focusers. Sitting around is the worst thing to do

If you have no security online, then presumably you don't have any fighters to do anything like that.

I think that's why people say any member should be able to pilot a construct if needed, and I agree with that.



Let's not kid ourselves. Everyone knows that even just one individual = that org. That's just how it works.

All it takes is one person to say, "hey, lets go stop them, follow me" I know for a fact, Glom non-coms will defend when asked, they do it all the time. Everyone should be willing to defend their Org, but maybe I'm just idealistic.

Idealism has nothing to do with it. You're going to lead a group of non-coms against the demisquad, which is entrenched in a preset demesne and all? Yeah, that'll go real well. Are you even thinking at all about what you're saying?

Very idealistic. I don't think everyone should, but it'd be nice if they felt that way. Just lessen the sting and let's move on with the game.

EDIT: And yea, they won't get very far.

Never underestimate the annoyance of having web and freeze whored at you?

And yes, demesnes are capable of killing non-coms without even needing the druid/mage to do very much.

You obviously didn't read my first post, we did it, we brought a group of non-coms against Serenwilde and almost succeeded, granted we were better prepared against Celest than that, but still

I don't understand why it is difficult to understand that maybe defending means you die a dozen times, but at least you give it a shot. it takes time to kill you a dozen times, time they aren't focusing on destroying constructs, more time for your unmanned construct to do more damage to a colossi, using a group of non-coms to defend, while even dying a dozen or two dozen times will make a difference. No defense means they can focus entirely on destroying constructs. Does it suck to fight in a fully prepared meld, yes, does it mean you can't succeed, no.

Are you even reading what I am saying? You are continually ignoring large parts of what I have typed. Will the group of non-coms die a lot? YES, does that mean it isn't worth it? NO

This is patently incorrect when said non-coms are in a hostile demesne. Squirrels/Murder, Spores, Pollen, Treelife, Treebane, Thorns, (Pathtwist for a Hartstone meld), and Swarm all hitting in the same instant (perhaps some firing a few seconds after the bulk of them; I never learned the setup for Blacktalon melds) will royally screw over an entire party without the raid group needing to do ANYTHING.

It would be the same if you had a group of non-com Serens or Gloms in an Aquamancer demesne, without anyone to break (assuming no one has Realitycheck) and without protection scrolls to use. The demesne effects would scatter your group without needing anyone to come bother.

Totally debatable. I don't think capitalizing the answers makes it any less subjective to the individual's values.

As I said, I'm an idealist, I think something is better than nothing.

Edit: as an addendum, I am willing to bet 100 credits against anyone that if some sort of defense was organized and put against us, and didn't give up in the middle, and gave it a shot the entire weakening, the most we would have destroyed is 2 constructs

You seem to have missed the point that this isn't being done at anyone's expense. Also, if this is all it takes to completely break Celest's spirit, then you have no one to blame but yourselves. Celest has suffered much greater losses in the past and kept on fighting. I'm sure you're exaagerating - if not, you blokes deserve whatever's coming your way to have laid down this soon.

You can't control what other people feel, so I'm not sure why a group of players have to suffer because another group of players don't want to participate. I'm fine with taking more heat, but it should be reasonably adjusted to allow an organization to eventually recover.

EDIT: Exaggerating? No. This whole thread is about how nobody tried.

EDIT2: You can, however, create a gaming environment where people don't feel the need to despair and give up and promote participation within the game.