No more sorcelglass! EDIT: Wait, no gold outlay increase? Ne'ermind. Still, put back the sorcelglass cost. Those were only useful when they were pegged to the cost of vials. EDITEDIT: And the wrong response would be to increase the gem cost for vials, unless you'd rather we all buy from Bob.

Would it be possible to have the village floor on comm prices drop a universal 25-50% and have the number of free-range (i.e. not miners/farmers) commodity making things go up by 25-50%?

Maybe I'm just having a faulty memory (gone for months) but it doesn't look like the gold outlay has gone up... a scroll is still a thousand, a book is still five and so on. The commdoities have all increased/doubled, but the gold looks the same. Also, there's no gold outlay at all that I can see for sorcelglass (though the commodities have gone up, of course). No commodity change for magic scrolls at all.

So, where are folks seeing increases in gold outlay?

Ah, I think I misunderstood the question.

When I'm talking gold outlay, I'm talking the amount of gold you have to spend. Not the random extra gold cost to use the bookbinding press. Sorry!

As I said. Gold outlay has not gone up. The intention of the change was to address stockpiles of 40k+ of each commodity, of which every organization does (at least, that has been around long enough to achieve such). It certainly makes a commercial government attractive, given they receive the largest amount of commodities (the tithes reach up towards the 90 percentile range at despotic/commercial) from villages.

But as people pointed out, won't this make orgs stockpile even more comms, now that they are that much more valuable?

Gold costs most definitely have gone up though, and when I see "outlay" that's what comes to mind first. Especially not having ever crafted books for sale.

I guess if they want to, sure. At the end of the day there's nothing we can do to stop organizations from stockpiling commodities - organizations have next to 0 use for commodities, however, and 40k+ stockpiles are flat silly. It's a silly level of paranoia and a sense of 'need' to possess something valuable. If Celest keeps their head on their shoulders, keeps doing commodity quests and all around moves forward intelligently, I have little doubt that they'll be just fine - and the same goes for the other orgs, too. I really think people are overreacting - there's an abundance of both commodities and gold in the game. Prices may rise appropriately given an increased cost-to-make, but really, I suspect I could find a large amount of players with more than 100k in their inventory.

I'm pretty confident, myself, as an observer to all of this, that things will level out soon enough.

Leaving an org twice over the course of almost 5 real life years does not qualify as a lot. :/

Then why implement a horribly unpopular change that you admit won't address the very problem it was put in place to address? I'm not trying to be sarcastic-- I really am unsure how this is supposed to affect that.

Can we have an option to influence splendors stats now? It's just prohibitive to shear/ reenchant at 200+ comms. Maybe a command for enchanters to dispel the enchantment on it.

This.

If the number of commodities required to create an item increases, the gold cost to purchase said item also increases as a result, because commodities aren't free. They're the primary determinant of cost for many items.

I'm not sure why there's any argument about this. Everything has just been made more expensive to craft, and also more expensive to purchase.

Because now credit prices are about to skyrocket. Damn you, Trader Bob. DAMN YOU

Nobody is debating this. Someone asked if the hard-coded gold amount required to bind a book, in addition to the commodity cost (which ranges from 0 gold to 30k or so) had been changed.

Yes, crafting will become more expensive.

Similarly, I point out that gold seems to be exceedingly more common - with influencing netting several tens of thousands in a matter of hours, and I understand that Aetherspace is fairly profitable besides. At this very moment, there's probably 40 or so people wander about with more than 500,000 gold on their person. A hundred or more people with more than 100k. It doesn't seem that long ago that gold was much rarer than that!

I'm quite convinced this is a positive change, for many reasons - I think after a couple weeks things will play out and everything will be for the best.

And those people are not inconvenienced in the least. Novices and those who are poorer are slammed. So they either start busting their ass to farm more gold, or stop buying things, while those who are making more than they can spend change nothing.

I have to disagree.

First off: influencing. How does this create tens of thousands of gold by itself? If you beg, you get it from a mob. Anyone who bashes that mob no longer gets the gold it had. Most mobs don't carry that much gold to add up that quickly, and not all can even be begged from. If you are referring to sell esteem for gold - that gold has to come from somewhere else. Namely, people bashing things for gold.

Aetherspace is good for exp farming, but I've yet to hear about people making gold off of it more efficiently than mob bashing. Perhaps it is best kept a secret, because I've heard that the trade ships rotate run out of things pretty quick, so if a lot of people were trying to do it all at once, suddenly it wouldn't be so profitable.

People have been running around with hundreds of thousands (sometimes millions) of gold for RL years. This is not a suddenly new trend. What happens is that people run out of things they feel are worth spending gold on besides credits, so they hold onto that gold until they can get what they feel is a good deal for their gold.

This is why the credit market keeps inflating.

There are a lot of things out there that these people don't feel the need to spend their gold on, apart from credits. You just made all those other things more expensive. This will not prompt them to want to buy more of them.

So what happens instead?

Oh, right. Credit inflation. And novices need to gather more gold just to get on their feet than they had to before.

If I am wrong, explain how.

Rate this is going our credit market is going to be as bad as Imperian where you cannot even get a credit for 10k. Can say goodbye to any new players as well. Know how intimidating it would be, entirely new to a game and you HAVE to buy and sell credits right from the getgo in order to get anywhere? If I were just starting and I seen that, I would be out of there without a glance back.

This whole thing looks like it was put in the punish orgs from stockpiling, here's a better idea! set a cap, you cannot have more than 10k in reserve, problem solved without making a bunch of people mad and inflating prices and running away potential new players. This would have been so much easier, or, get rid of being able to have reserves at all. Rainy day, run to a village if you need something or hope your allies do not mind you raiding THEIR commodity shop, what are allies for anyways?

All this is really doing is hurting new players/novices and shopkeepers. My shop is my only source of income in game anymore, I have my days I will go out an influence though I do not make gold from it, even my esteem though that is my own fault in that.

This would have been significantly more efficient for the stated goal, as well as a lot less work for the admins.

On Influencing:

I think Eventru was also referring to the esteem market, but do remember that that fluctuates very much. Right now the average price across the board is 5000g/100%, but I am guessing that will go down more (like it did last year), then bump back up to 10k levels near December when everyone and their mother is fighting for shrines for Ascension, then wave down again, etc.

That's... actually a very small number given Lusternia's population, no? And pretty much all of those would be established folk, who are still not going to go out of their way to spend it. On the whole, they will just buy less and count it as no great loss.

I'm speaking as one of those hoarders myself; I'm just not as likely to buy things. For example, sorcelglasses? What the heck is the point now? It costs so many more times than just making new vials for myself (and takes more time and effort to boot) that it's more efficient just to make new vials when I need them. In every sense. Previously, the cost was already higher over time and it already took more work, but it was close enough that I could justify it being "cool". Now, not so much.

Clothing? Why bother?

Books? Unnecessary.

I'm slowly plopping runes on my jewellery, so a good half of it doesn't even decay any more; this actually just makes it more desirable to finish that off sooner rather than later.

Etc, etc.

Also, I've had all this gold in my bank account for a very long time. I didn't just randomly magic it up recently.

I'm just not seeing how what you're saying here in any way is relevant to the actual players of the game. You have seriously slammed up prices across the board for everyone. This includes people returning to Lusternia to decay spam and to newbies (who we supposedly want to keep, I thought). These people tend to have really poor gold income anyways. And now, the same effort to get the same amount of gold is only half as effective as trade supplies go; I've heard so many newbies bash up their 20-40k for their masterweapons and get so excited about it. Now they have to do twice as much to achieve the same goal, and then have to do it again for plate. Gah!

Edit: PS:
If you dislike our gold stockpiles too, you could always try an auction where you bid in gold instead of credits. That's probably about the only way to get me to pull gold out of the bank, heh. In general now, when I put gold in the bank, I'm effectively "removing" it from the game. I pretty much never touch it again.