Unnominate Celina as Leader
Unvote: Othero


Nominate Othero as Leader

I actually like Lorick's plan better. As for trusting me, I'm not really trying to pull any sort of fast one. I'm putting myself up on the chopping block so I can be confirmed as town and so people know about my revenge ability. I'm not a fan of it because it almost always goes off on a townie. If I was mafia I wouldn't be putting myself out like this.

What? First, this was never my plan. Ever. This was someone else's plan that they blamed on me. You want to vote in Othero, and then kill him. How do you propose we do that? If we have a vig, sure it works, and before Othero revealed that we had a hunter (the revenge killer guy) I was willing to assume we had a vig. (Side note: You people keep saying that I said wanted to daykill people in contexts that I never did...) But with my plan, if everyone is telling the truth, we know it works.

Celina claimed resistant to any kill besides lynching. Which presumably includes the backlash. Othero said he auto-kills the last person to vote for him. If we make Celina leader, and then kill have her finish the vote on Othero, he should backlash, she should survive, and we have a semi-verified claim. Yes, she could still be mafia with a kill shield, but it's better than any other option we have right now. If you have a better plan, by all means share it.

If we nominate Othero for unlynchable, then it's exactly the same as electing anyone else. We have no verification of his abilities at all. I don't understand why Lorick magically trusts Othero more than Celina. As Vendetta pointed out, they both volunteered to sacrifice things for the good of the town.




Your plan needs a vig or a resser. Mine only needs Celina and Othero.

Except we end up with a dead Othero for our trouble with only a power confirmed Celina. This way we either end up with a dead leader (Your initial suggestion), a dead and ressed townie leader (Again, should have nothing against that), or an obvious scum whom we can deal with. I'm disinclined to believe option three, although you should never believe Othero can't be devious and if he says anything else he is selling something.

What is Lorick's plan, in your words? How exactly do you propose we kill you? Like I said, without a better option I was willing to bank on the presence of a vig, but given what we know now, there's no reason to make that assumption.

Plus "If I was mafia I wouldn't put myself out like this" is very much a Sicilian "wine in front of me" game. We can only assume that you're town because you offered to sacrifice yourself. If you don't actually die, it does us no good. Notice that Lorick swooped in and derailed the lynch only to try to get Othero in as leader? If we don't kill you, it throws suspicion on both you and Lorick, and at that point you're unlynchable.

If you don't want to be sacrificed anymore, say so, but it's going to be one of the scummiest things you can do.

If we don't have a vig to deal with it, I'll do it myself, tomorrow. Fair enough?

Lorick, seriously. HOW are you going to kill Othero? Your plan, assuming you're talking about my original plan, requires the presence of a vig. Which was an assumption I was willing to make without a better killing role available. Othero is PERFECT for this. He offered himself for a sac, which is what this is, and if he backs out now it looks like he was just trying to engender trust which makes him scummy as hell, but people will be afraid to vote for him because of the backlash.

I don't understand why you're willing to gamble on the presence of a vigilante when we have a killing role who's already claimed AND offered to die for the good of town.

That wasn't a response to Lorick's post. Lorick, are you claiming one of your abilities lets you kill people?

I claimed jack of all trades. Traditionally, it comes with an array of powers. I told you to think so I didn't have to do this when we were talking about Celina.. Gah, I have to be blunt as a hammer sometimes.

You'll have to forgive me. I'm a little out of touch with the flavor of "traditionally" that you guys use around here. In my form of traditionally, killers don't get many other powers unless they're scummy. So I assumed you had a 1 shot protection, a 1 shot investigation, apparently a useless summon deal with which to fool the town, you know, things like that. Utility stuff.

People that play here a lot: Do you guys really get swiss army knives with kill powers?

@requiem: I can't remember someone having a set of powers quite like his before no.

I can't talk about me except in vague terms because of Bali's new no paraphrase rule, but traditionally, jack of all trades tends to have an array of limited or circumstantial powers, normally reserved for the day. If you look at the restrictions on my first attempt, perhaps you can figure out what my limitations are.

In other mafia games, yes. I believe it is the first time we've had this particular take on the role for Bali's games, but I sort of suspect him to throw us a few new loops.

So in short, no Lorick. That's not good enough for me.

Do you have a really good reason not to use my plan besides that I thought of it? If everyone is telling the truth, it makes sense. Your way involves a LOT more good will than my plan.

Also, we don't actually have any proof that the king couldn't have answered anything you wanted. You claim Bali PM'd you, but that could just be an excuse. You blatantly refused to try anything that would have helped the town. I'm starting to seriously think that you're scum (probably a serial killer, given the JoaT claim), rather than just scummy acting.

And you are attempting to hammer in an unproven individual into a position you fought me over because you can't prove faction... _And_ get someone you've stated you suspected as town killed in the process. On top of that, whenever someone actually puts forth a suggestion to help your plan you you jump on them, but I can't help feel that was perhaps mainly because I suggested it. Which caused you to jump down Othero's throat all over again.

Celina in as leader has more at risk with the current information we have than Othero in as leader. I've stated why this is so, and you seem to be stuck on the fact we can kill one townie, weaken another, and get someone the town doesn't know from adam in the slot you've fought so hard to keep me out of. Make up your mind, do you want someone we can semi confirm and if so try and achieve it with the least amount of mass claim/bloodshed. Anything else is wasteful and at worst, scummy.

That was actually why Othero volunteered... It was a "blue" sac. Blue = villager, in case the slang is different here. It's an intentional sacrifice of a volunteer townie to help the town as a whole. So yes, I'm trying to lynch a townie. That was the plan when he volunteered.

And go find me quotes. I didn't "jump on you" for improving my plan. You switched to a different plan entirely, blamed it on me, and then failed to articulate how you planned to kill Othero in the first place. (Also, allow me to point out that you still want the townie dead).

Othero offered himself as a sacrifice, and then took it back. The only reason people do that is because they're mafia. It's a gamble, since you usually get lynched when you volunteer for it, but if you can pull it off you're effectively cleared. So if Othero really doesn't want to be lynched now, that's all the more reason to continue to lynch him.

I'm not suggesting we "weaken" Celina. I've already explained why her ability is worthless now. Mafia just won't try to kill her unless they can double-tap her in one night. There's no point now that she's claimed. So instead of useless, I'm suggesting we convert her ability into verification that she's telling the truth.

I also never really fought you over the leadership position. I just said that I didn't support you unless you verified yourself, and you failed spectacularly to do so. I've never seriously pushed for unlynchable.

Again, Lorick. How can we semi-confirm Othero? You seem to be our only option for your plan, and that only works on day 2. My plan works immediately, only kills Othero, puts someone willing to take a hit into the leadership position (which also means we can hopefully remove her if it becomes an issue in the future).

Your semi-confirmation is just as weak as mine.

Well, there was one unused role in the Touhou mafia that had an array of gimmick powers. One was a katana that could kill people, but it had a high risk of breaking. That game was also very power/death/destruction heavy. I can't recall any other games with something even comparable.

Looks like Lorick has already started up and upset some of the players.

I think Lorick is implying he's a townie with vig powers, so he wants to use Othero, waste a kill on him, then waste a rez on him all for a kill condition that can be circumvented. Interesting that your "too many variables" argument is followed by a plan with twice the number of variables. Nor have you proven reliable in using your powers.

And really, someone who can summon an undead magic 8 ball every day also has a killing ability and a plethora of other things does not sound terribly....realistic.

@Requiem: Do not ask for quotes. I asked him for quotes in the last game. It started one hell of a train wreck that took days to sort through.

Anyway if Lorick does have a daykill (thats what he was alluding to I guess?) Why doesn't he just use it on Celina then? Wasn't that the original plan or am I missing something?

He conveniently can't use another power during the day.

I really don't see how people can blame me for seeing Lorick as scummy when he always acts like this