Yeah, I would like to see guild guards attack guild enemies.

Pardon my ignorance, but in the Seren which guards are guild guards? As opposed to commune guards.

That's easy. All guards are guild guards. There are no Commune-specific varieties, all are related to one of the guilds.

But I did.

Not according to the reason.

You'll have to do it again.

You've ruined my enemy columns! Jerk.

Hags = MD
Nature elementals you don't see = HS
Warders = Shofangi
Songs you don't see = SS
Centaurs = SG

So SG, Shofangi and MD enemying will all matter beyond obstructing everyone else welcoming people arbitrarily, but SS and HS won't really. Well, maybe HS a tiny bit.

A small fyi even clans have the ability to enemy and perms work for any org. The only real reason to care about an enemy status is if they have something you need or want regardless of the org type (city/commune/guild/clan/mob).

Due to the way lusternia has been set up there is rarely anything that one org wants that they can't get from members of their own org or parent org in some guild cases. The only way I can see right now (without implementing or changing anything) to make guild enemy status matter would be enforcing shop permissions and ship permissions, however both of these would likely only affect members of the parent org.

If you think about it... make the commune/city leadership elected rather than just the current guild leaders and guilds become largely impotent, the only reason for them being to get your skills.

Seriously, someone could go get a clan, find some members, start enemying people for... (random pointless reason) and if they could get the right people into it people would be trying to have their enemy status lifted. Why? Get enough shopkeepers in on it and shops start shutting down across the basin to you, Get PKers and they have a reason to kill you, Get org leaders and they dislike you when you try to join or advance plus they could turn a blind eye to the basin wideness of the org. It would rely on a certain level of cliqueness but it would not even need to be intentional it could simply happen.

I think I'm well off track now but really... I don't think the enemy ability should be removed simply that there should be some meaning to it, preventing guild enemies from joining your parent org only happens if the parent agrees and you likely are not going to stop someone if they have powerful friends who really want to get them in. While shop lock downs are ineffective on a guild level unless the guild makes deals with shops outside the control of its membership.


Part of me is dying to mention ToP planetary/station control as that system seems like it would allow enemy statuses of non-city orgs to have a bigger impact.

You sure you'd REALLY like that Everiine? >_>

I think at that point you might have the rest of Serenwilde screaming at you to get rid of the enemy status...

Civil War anyone?

I haven't had nearly as much fun now that the Ladies, Avatars, and shrines stopped attacking me .

Disclaimer: I'm not advocating being an enemy to half your own org . But it sure is entertaining.

And holy crap, we can attack guild enemies inside the Serenwilde now? Hot damn, wish I'd known that earlier. Every time I tried to fight for that right it was shot down, and nobody tells me things change when I return >.<.

Particularly for the guilds who can also now brand to factions (lords/aspects/avatars/dls/sups) it's very useful to also guild enemy, since most guild members can't see if someone is enemied to these factions, they can assume both if one is enemied to the guild. Also, as far as my experience goes with both enemying and unenemying, everyone seems to treat it as a two-for-one.



This is a terrible idea. Having one guild be able to block members of its own org from the Nexus/other important places? Not good at all. Even leaving aside the disparity between guard types in guilds, I'm glad the code does not allow for this. These guards don't belong to the guild, they belong to the commune/city. The org pays for their hire/upkeep.

There is an easy solution to this. Don't get enemied to other guilds in your Org.

The commune/city doesn't summon guards, in fact if I dismissed all Hags in the Serenwilde or didn't summon new ones when old ones were killed there is nothing the Serenwilde as an entity to itself can do. Why? Because they are Moondancer guards, not Serenwilde Guards. Power also comes from the efforts of the people in the org, so the org doesn't pay for them as an entity to itself, the people in the org pay for them by doing things that gives the org power. The Power Minister could just as easily assign guuard power to each guild based on power contributions of that guild.

The power minister could... but that just points out a nice big hole in your theory. Guilds can't summon guards without 1) Spending the Commune's money, 2) Spending the Commune's power, and 3) Having the Commune allocate that power to them. As well as putting money in the Power Ministry. Soo... yeah. If you dismissed the hags Serenwilde can't get them back, but Serenwilde could easily remove them as well by dropping your power allotment to 0.

Since, I think, the goal of the set up is to create the sense that every guild contributes their part to org defense on the whole, I'm very glad that there are limits in place to prevent the opposite, where every guild might begin acting on their own.

The easy solution, to not get enemied to a guild in your org is obviously correct, but because players control this, and because there is no code to verify the validity of an enemying, I don't think players should have access to inflicting such a dire consequence, particularly on members of their own org.

I guess the inter-org power struggles are a fun part of the game for some people... obviously given my role, I do not agree. I just think that having certain guilds - and remember, this is not an option equally available to all guilds, given the differing types of guards - be able to strong-arm individuals within an org is a really bad idea.

It doesn't put a nice big hole in any theory. The Serenwilde can refuse to let you have your guards, they cannot however summon your guards. Guards belong to the guild, whether you want to argue the entity of Serenwilde pays for them or the people who make up that entity pay for them and is allocated the power for them. In fact, I think that is probably the best check and balance there is, if a guild abuses the enemy privs within its own org the leadership can simply say "we don't want your guards then".

Edit:; At any rate, I have better things to do than argue semantics, so I am going to go enjoy the rest of my weekend out of town. Final note: Guild enemying has a valid reason for being, whether it is abused or not.

Sorry, but I disagree. If you're paying for them, they don't somehow mysteriously "belong" to someone else. The only thing guilds can do is type the command to summon them, and then move them around-- which is nice for some RP (differing types of guards) and gives guilds something to feel like they are doing to defend the Commune. That is no reason for them to be able to kill Commune members simply because some guild leader is feeling a bit abusive today.

(So, yes, it does put a nice big hole in your theory, whether you want to admit it or not. Person paying for it tends to own the things, and tends to have the final say. Don't like what the guilds are doing, stop paying for it, end of the story. That doesn't mean guilds should be able to abuse it and force this to happen, though. For example: Guild enemy Chuck while Chuck is at the Ravenwood. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Chuck conglutinates. Guards kill Chuck. Etc.)

That said, I'm fine with guards attacking guild enemies -if- you can't guild enemy someone who is part of your organization (and someone can't join if an enemy of one of the guilds). Potential abuses solved.

I'm starting to feel like every Ideas thread degenerates into Xenthos and Gregori arguing...

Pretty sure I haven't even posted in a number of them, like the Bard/Druid one...