The dictionary makes every definition pretty generic, so sure, it fits.

As I said, my problem wasn't with enemy status as much as enemy status to an order "for shrine effects," which is mechanically ridiculous (Order Wars? Not really.) and quite unnecessary in this one case.

The other problem with these scenarios is that the "defending organization" typically has no clue that one of their own has just been out causing trouble. We react to what we see happening without knowing the reasoning behind it. Not that the enemy statuses wouldn't still stand or anything, but maybe we'd all feel more justified in our actions and reactions. Or not.

Raiders get enemied to organizations and orders that defend that territory.

SOP. Whether or not an individual thinks it's "unnecessary," that's just the way it is. Getting enemied to an order while off in neutral territory so a shrine can hit is a bit more of something to complain about, but this one... if you want to change it, you've got the power to start trying to change it in your org first. However, unless you try (and succeed), don't expect anyone else to.

I don't expect it to change, certainly, and so I have no intentions of trying to change it. I'd rather grab a shovel and go move a mountain over a few inches...

I remember when you could defend your territory and not get enemied to an organisation and three separate Orders. Wish we could go back to that.

That's why I started on this little "discussion," basically. Iasmos went 160+ years without any real enemy status, and he hasn't changed his behavior, except that now he might be considered more of a threat because he actually kills people when they come after us.

You started this discussion way too late, then. From the very beginning, the Gods should have said no to their Orders enemying people for things that aren't directly an attack on the Order. Some of them decided it was a good idea, but unfortunately, others just let their followers run wild. Things started spiralling when one person/order started it and then a couple more decided they shouldn't be at a disadvantage and did it too. The outcome is what we have today.

For what it's worth, I feel the whole order conflict benefit/conflict system should be scrapped. No more war/shield/healing shrines with area effects. No more mobs to influence/kill. We have no real motivation to fight so few people against one another (orders are smaller than any city or commune, generally), and so it just ends up being another extension to city/commune defense.

If you think I'm late, how about that recent change to make distant order members cost essence? That's way late to the game.

This is, however, a completely different discussion; in this case, the enemying was not handed out for defending one's territory, but for coming into the opposing force's territory and attacking a resident of that organization there.

Which is and has always been SOP as long as I've been playing, heh.

We don't (usually) enemy people for defending their organization, or even for fighting in neutral territory (Faethorn not being considered neutral all the time, for one reason or another). There are some exceptions here and there, and Rage covens often get a lot of people enemied at once, but on the whole it feels better than blanket enemying the other side.

I will admit there are exceptions from time to time, and I can't really justify them, but I do not feel this case is an exception.

When our little commune war first broke out, Glomdoring blanket enemied a good portion of Serenwilde. (No idea if we did, too. Just saying that it happens.) Before that, I had never once even set foot into Glomdoring.

The one time I accidentally followed Ixion into Etherglom, I was declared enemy to Glomdoring, Nocht, Nightspirit, and the Shadowdancers. Shadowdancers? Heh.

Pretty sure my enemy status to Glomdoring was just from being Hierophant, but I could be wrong.

You probably did.

After the Dwarf incident, Serenwilde (well, primarily Mirami) randomly enemied a bunch of Gloms to stuff that they hadn't been enemied to before, so Glom just responded by blanket branding Serenwilde's leaders (people in HELP SERENWILDE).

That would fall under the "exception" line I was talking about and not really justified by my overall premise, but I did mention that there were some exceptions!

Everybody I enemied there was in our CHELP AMNESTY scroll, so they'd all been enemies before. I don't randomly enemy people... They have to do something first!

EDIT: I totally agree with the principle you're trying to say, though- it's quite annoying to be enemied to Fain, Night, Maylea, or Nocht for successfully defending your territory against an Order-Head who decided to attack solo. (It's even more annoying, when they go back later an enemy you to Mag/Glomdoring/Serenwilde for being an enemy of their Patron, branding you to the org for 'being an enemy of '....)

Your amnesty scroll had issues, then, and whoever wrote it randomly put names in it. Heh.

True. I was never an enemy of any of the Seren guilds and orders, and then I was. So I thought I should do something to merit my enemy status.

*gasp* You mean... you mean... there was DISORGANIZATION? In SERENWILDE?!

He was surely mistaken.

Some highly suspicious claims of innocence going on in here.

I agree with Shiri.

Killing kids is a lousy way to earn an enemy status, at any rate.

Kegs. Tradeban. Next?