Actually, for me it seems that the counter attack has gotten weaker. It used to make me worry someone had begun debating me. Now it takes of less than a regular influence does.

The counter-attacks will hit harder as the 'debate' so to speak goes on.

Yes, but prior to this change, any counterattack would take more ego than the influence itself. Now I don't notice it at all.

Influencing definitely seems to be costing less ego, from what I see.

if you want to even out the playfield a bit I think the retort should come regardless of you getting an influence in.

At least if the intention is to make influencing harder for all, not just low char races

This ^ is a bad idea. Please god no.

Influencing godrealm mobs with 16 CHA is taking a lot longer, but I'm getting more esteem and not seeing any rebuttal hits. Things look good there to me.

Kind of how it was for me trying to complete the Hallifax epic.

But now I'm so loaded with influencing boosts, it's almost tolerable. I only get counters when my connection is a little slow. I'll see how things are now once I get off work...

7415h, 5952m, 7056e, 10p, 23400en, 18900w elrxkdb<>-

influence cthoglogg with amnesty
Summoning all your powers of negotiation, you entreat Cthoglogg, the High Ritualist to forgive your trespasses and grant amnesty in the Illithoid Prisoners.
Cthoglogg, the High Ritualist sneers contemptuously at you and proclaims you are not worth the effort to spit, much less be considered in any negotiations.
7415h, 5952m, 2710e, 10p, 23400en, 18895w lrxkdb<>-


Yea...

So, support my bring amnesty back up idea!

"More esteem" is really not much of a perk -- everyone is getting more esteem, so the value of esteem will drop precisely as much as the supply is increasing. Effectively it just means karma got a little quicker to earn, and that's about it.

Maybe it's doable with someone chanting laetitia or using a horn. Or more than one person.

That wasn't even a counter attack. :|

It would actually be pretty cool of Avatars/Supernals/DLs weren't buffed as much (or at all) as the Spheres and Fleshpots were. That might the other orgs a viable alternative to raiding instead of just continuously hitting Halli and Gaudi.

The amnesty bit isn't too hot. It would be lovely if that could be detached and balanced on its own.

The spheres are, by their very nature, easier to kill - they certainly are no half-formed, nor an Avatar of a Great Spirit. A sphere should take about half as long to kill as a Supernal (and even longer for Elohora/Luciphage/Avatars).

However, they shouldn't be 'easy', either - two or three spheres is the equivalent of taking down a Supernal, in every way.

I note that I say 'sphere,' but this also includes fleshpots as well.

I don't really think they're that much 'easier' to kill than half-formed, however - if nothing else, they have 2 defenders on the first fight, defenders that can't be killed unless they move to them.

However, this shouldn't turn into a discussion on smobs, as they really are outliers overall, and were not the primary targets of this change!

Well, they are still part of the change aren't they? And they play a huge part in the game orgs and for the players, especially for the new cities since we're have to revive them every few weeks and then grind our shields back up.

Yep, tbh a big reason why halli and gaudis pots/spheres get hit hard is because they're comparatively much much much easier to kill than avatars, etc. Buffing the latter only encourages more of the former.

They do not obey the base "rules" of the change, so to speak, no - their health was buffed an additional amount, their XP gains were drastically increased, among other things.

I suspect the intention here is to gather feedback on the change to bashing and influencing over all. The changes to the half-formed are a lesser (not to say it's not a big one on its own!) conversation/topic and, while one that can certainly be had, it shouldn't be 98% of this thread's postings - and if they move that way, it should instead be shifted to another thread altogether, so as not to dominate the discussion.

Of course, given that no one has fought smobs after the second round of buffs for them, anything to be offered on that point is pure conjecture! Though you are certainly very, very welcome to go raiding to gauge their difficulty. (I'll even tell you I think we may need to tone some things down, ie the proc rate on self-healing, or the amount - but we'll see!)

Put in context, that's after 20+ hits though. It may still need adjusting, but I was able to do it with 22 cha earlier, albeit using roulade. I bothered Estarra about it, on this mob specifically, repeatedly during testing until it was definitely reasonably possible, if challenging, and imho that's what it is. There still is that random factor where sometimes they just won't go, and you have to restart, it may take some practice to re-learn where that "okay, this mob is stubborn" point is, but eh, I guess we will see. I could only test with me!