Talan2011-05-26 22:17:41
Re: Syrio being alive or dead -- as sappy and wonderful as it would be to have Syrio show up in Braavos and help Arya get back to the waiting arms of Gendry so they can hurry off to the Wall where their wedding can be officiated by their majesties, Mister and Missus Jon Targaryen - I take Feast as evidence that Martin loathes these kinds of deux ex machina reunions, and rather delights in leaving both dozens of loose ends and ample time for his fan base to mull them over and speculate. Oddly, it had never occurred to me before that Syrio made it out alive. So thanks for that, I'll just add it to the list of "I wonder if's!"
Jack2011-05-26 22:46:44
QUOTE (Eventru @ May 26 2011, 08:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I also think Jon Snow's lineage is being more heavily thrown into question in the series than it was in the book - maybe it's just me?
Eventru2011-05-26 23:02:53
Rule number one is never, ever assume a character is dead unless it specifically states such. All we know is that Syrio was kicking some serious King's Guard ass when he told Arya to run - even with a broken sword, braavosi swordsmen are known as some of the most skilled duelists in the entire world - I suspect Syrio could have survived. The rather excellent quote regarding Death could well have been a setup toward the storyline - if Syrio doesn't tell Arya to run, grin at his opponent and say, "Not today" or some variation thereof, I'll be mildly disappointed. I have no realistic hopes regarding Syrio, and he's quite likely dead - but the fact he was not specifically stated as dead jumps out at me. Particularly for an author, like Martin, who enjoys killing off his characters /and making it known/. Similarly, look at Caitlin Stark - although murdered, she does return, albeit horrifically changed. I wouldn't be too surprised if Syrio turns up alive, at the Night's Watch or something. No, I agree, it's wholly unrealistic that he'll have a pleasant fairy tale ending with Arya - but I'm hoping we'll see his character return in some regard, alive.
If you really want something to consider, I've long held the belief that Jon Snow is the son of Lyanna Stark and Rhaegar Targaryen, who ran away to be together. This was Lyanna's secret that Ned's taken to his grave - and why he would defile his own honour so much by claiming Jon as his own bastard. He would've failed his secret promise to Lyanna to protect Jon, because she loved Rhaegar - and he knew Robert and the others would kill Jon in a heartbeat if it was discovered. Similarly, Rhaegar, prior to this, believed his son, Aegon, was the prophesied "Prince That Was Promised". However, on the belief that Jon is Lyanna's and Rhaegar's son, he is in fact the fabled Prince. The notion first struck me when I was re-reading, and Lyanna's last words were 'Promise me, Ned. Promise me...' - the usual implied sensationalism Martin is a rather masterful expert at utilizing. To fulfill the prophecy, I think we'll see Ice make its way to Jon Snow, as it was 'forged' in the blood of a loved one (Sir Payne executed Ned with it, followed by changing the sword for his own perverse use). Alternately Longclaw, but I'm not sure how we'll see that play out (forged in the blood of a loved one, unless it's a reference to the people that died in the events that lead up to him becoming Lord Commander - or, perhaps, the sword is metaphorical, and it is in fact the Night's Watch! Indeed, their oath is:
Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men. I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all the nights to come.
And so it is wholly possible that the prophesied 'sword' is in fact the Night's Watch ('the sword in the darkness'), Jon Snow is the Prince That Was Promised, and is poised to save the realm!
Yes, I read far too much into these books - I do it with everything! I love reading.
If you really want something to consider, I've long held the belief that Jon Snow is the son of Lyanna Stark and Rhaegar Targaryen, who ran away to be together. This was Lyanna's secret that Ned's taken to his grave - and why he would defile his own honour so much by claiming Jon as his own bastard. He would've failed his secret promise to Lyanna to protect Jon, because she loved Rhaegar - and he knew Robert and the others would kill Jon in a heartbeat if it was discovered. Similarly, Rhaegar, prior to this, believed his son, Aegon, was the prophesied "Prince That Was Promised". However, on the belief that Jon is Lyanna's and Rhaegar's son, he is in fact the fabled Prince. The notion first struck me when I was re-reading, and Lyanna's last words were 'Promise me, Ned. Promise me...' - the usual implied sensationalism Martin is a rather masterful expert at utilizing. To fulfill the prophecy, I think we'll see Ice make its way to Jon Snow, as it was 'forged' in the blood of a loved one (Sir Payne executed Ned with it, followed by changing the sword for his own perverse use). Alternately Longclaw, but I'm not sure how we'll see that play out (forged in the blood of a loved one, unless it's a reference to the people that died in the events that lead up to him becoming Lord Commander - or, perhaps, the sword is metaphorical, and it is in fact the Night's Watch! Indeed, their oath is:
Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness. I am the watcher on the walls. I am the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wakes the sleepers, the shield that guards the realms of men. I pledge my life and honor to the Night's Watch, for this night and all the nights to come.
And so it is wholly possible that the prophesied 'sword' is in fact the Night's Watch ('the sword in the darkness'), Jon Snow is the Prince That Was Promised, and is poised to save the realm!
Yes, I read far too much into these books - I do it with everything! I love reading.
Lilia2011-05-26 23:11:57
Eventru2011-05-26 23:36:02
It's all conjecture, though.
Some people argue The Prince is in fact Daenarys, from a conversation w/ the old Night Watch Maester (who is a Targaryen) where he says that they always assumed it was male, what fools they were, dragons had no gender (implying the Valerian word is in fact 'dragon,' and they only assumed it meant a human - 'dragon' being synonymous with 'king' or 'ruler'). I've heard some arguments based also in Dothraki lore "The prince is riding, and he is the Stallion Who Mounts the World" or something akin to that. This was believed to be Rhaego, who died in Daenarys' womb, who in turn was burned in a funeral pyre that gave birth to three dragons, one of which is Rhaegal, who is in fact now the Stallion. The argument goes that the Stallion/the dragons are in fact the Sword forged in the blood of a loved one (Drogo and Rhaegal's funeral), marking Daenarys as the Prince That Was Promised.
I'm honestly not very fond of Daenarys as a protagonist, and largely view her as a budding antagonist, who will clash with the Westerosi in the final book and perish to a true protagonist (Arya/Jon/Bran). That's pure conjecture, though (and perhaps wishful thinking).
Some people argue The Prince is in fact Daenarys, from a conversation w/ the old Night Watch Maester (who is a Targaryen) where he says that they always assumed it was male, what fools they were, dragons had no gender (implying the Valerian word is in fact 'dragon,' and they only assumed it meant a human - 'dragon' being synonymous with 'king' or 'ruler'). I've heard some arguments based also in Dothraki lore "The prince is riding, and he is the Stallion Who Mounts the World" or something akin to that. This was believed to be Rhaego, who died in Daenarys' womb, who in turn was burned in a funeral pyre that gave birth to three dragons, one of which is Rhaegal, who is in fact now the Stallion. The argument goes that the Stallion/the dragons are in fact the Sword forged in the blood of a loved one (Drogo and Rhaegal's funeral), marking Daenarys as the Prince That Was Promised.
I'm honestly not very fond of Daenarys as a protagonist, and largely view her as a budding antagonist, who will clash with the Westerosi in the final book and perish to a true protagonist (Arya/Jon/Bran). That's pure conjecture, though (and perhaps wishful thinking).
Ytran2011-05-26 23:45:43
QUOTE (Eventru @ May 26 2011, 06:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
snip
Regarding Jon's parents, Lyanna and Rhaegar currently seems to be the most likely outcome of that particular thread. Beyond what you've mentioned, there's a lot of stuff regarding Lyanna's promise that implies it has to do with Jon. For instance, Jon is fourteen years old while we're following Ned around, and he mentions (I can't remember the exact quote, unfortunately) that he's been lying or carrying that burden for fourteen years, or some such. There's also Lyanna lying in her own blood when Ned finds her, but the exact circumstances are not explained; it's very much possible that the blood was from her giving birth to Jon, and that was what killed her. Furthermore, why would Rhaegar have 3 of the kingsguard defending her if not for some very, very good reason? And it seems like protecting his son would be a very, very good reason. One other thing that sticks out is that Lyanna's favourite flower was some sort of blue winter rose or some such, and one of Dany's visions in the house of the Undying Ones is that of a petal of that rose lodged in a gianormous wall of ice, which sounds pretty familiar.
As for the Prince That Was Promised, it's probably a bit early to make any assumptions in that regard, since it's not really been spelled out what exactly the Prince is, aside from some mutterings by Melisandre regarding her belief that he is Stannis and that he's going to fight off the Great Other and such. It's plenty possible that it is referring potentially to Jon, who will find the proper Lightbringer and so forth, but it's too early to really say.
What I'm waiting for is some sort of resolution of what happened with Osha and Rickon. At this point, what I'd really want to see from them is their going south, finding the Neck, and being taken in by Howland Reed; it's been stated numerous times that he's the only one who knows what happened when Eddard found Lyanna, so I imagine he has to be the person to make the revelation either way. However, Osha and Rickon heading there doesn't seem likely to prompt him to go into it, since Rickon is four and Osha is a wildling, but who knows.
Also want to know what happens with Bran/Jojen/Meera; given Bran's dream after he falls, right before he wakes up, it's implied that he will have a very large role in whatever happens involving the Great Other. Bran's storyline is also going to (hopefully) reveal who Coldhands is, which also seems that it could be of much importance.
Incidentally, the words of the Night's Watch are some of my favourite things ever. So awesome.
Aramel2011-05-26 23:47:43
I didn't really like the casting for Jon Snow in the series. He's so... round. The Starks were described as long-faced and solemn, Jon particularly so.
Also, more "silent and intent", please.
Also, more "silent and intent", please.
Eventru2011-05-27 01:33:10
QUOTE (Ytran @ May 26 2011, 07:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Snip
The running theory seems to be that he's Benjen Stark. I suspect he's far older, but very likely that he's a Stark of some age (though it's odd, since my memory leaves me with the impression that he's quite possibly a wight!). It'll be interesting to see what the story tells, but if it's Benjen, he was not only a wight, but the Children of the Forest 'salvaged' him somehow. I want to say there's more to Jojen Reed than meets the eyes, as well - we'll see!
Unknown2011-05-27 02:19:35
I realised how much details I've forgotten about the series since I last read it.
Unknown2011-05-27 19:52:37
There are more black lines here than a prison inmate gathering
i'll be here all night folks
i'll be here all night folks
Reiha2011-06-01 00:10:52
QUOTE (Lehki @ May 25 2011, 08:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I never really liked Visaeris. Then I got to Eventru's post and realized this thread was about something else entirely.
Ditto, except I liked Visaeris.
Krackenor2011-06-01 01:24:29
QUOTE (Eventru @ May 26 2011, 09:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
blurb
You think that because he has, surprise surprise, ice cold hands. Also, Sam thought that he was a wight the first time he was encountered
Krackenor2011-06-06 10:34:49
He lives!
You called it, Eventru
You called it, Eventru
Unknown2011-06-08 00:23:07
Worry not childrens.
I persist.
I persist.
Reiha2011-06-08 00:31:16
QUOTE (Visaeris Maeloch @ Jun 7 2011, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Worry not childrens.
I persist.
I persist.
You'll be gone again soon and we'll all be bored.
Unknown2011-06-08 18:56:47
So what, we wont see Syrio again until season 9 or something?
Ytran2011-06-08 21:06:21
Whether or not Syrio is alive is still unknown.
Ytran2011-06-17 06:55:18
This is one of the most hilarious videos ever.
Book 1/Ep. 9 spoilers and harsh language: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owf6D2vfZqM
(Is posting links to videos w/ harsh language against the rules? I'll take this down if so.)
Book 1/Ep. 9 spoilers and harsh language: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owf6D2vfZqM
(Is posting links to videos w/ harsh language against the rules? I'll take this down if so.)
Casilu2011-06-17 07:01:30
QUOTE (Ytran @ Jun 16 2011, 11:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This is one of the most hilarious videos ever.
Book 1/Ep. 9 spoilers and harsh language: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owf6D2vfZqM
(Is posting links to videos w/ harsh language against the rules? I'll take this down if so.)
Book 1/Ep. 9 spoilers and harsh language: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owf6D2vfZqM
(Is posting links to videos w/ harsh language against the rules? I'll take this down if so.)
Just make sure you label it. And really, be more bold. Post links to anything you want until you get a message from Fain saying not to post links to porn on the forums.
Talan2011-06-17 11:25:55
QUOTE (Ytran @ Jun 17 2011, 02:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This is one of the most hilarious videos ever.
Book 1/Ep. 9 spoilers and harsh language: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owf6D2vfZqM
(Is posting links to videos w/ harsh language against the rules? I'll take this down if so.)
Book 1/Ep. 9 spoilers and harsh language: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owf6D2vfZqM
(Is posting links to videos w/ harsh language against the rules? I'll take this down if so.)
This made me literally lol. "No, not f- the white man, f- the BLONDE man!" I watched this guy's formal review of the episode, and it is equally amusing, thanks!